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97 Vanguard2 23hp motor swap....belt?
I have a 97 Vanguard 2 that I just swapped a 23hp B+S vanguard into, the motor came out of a 2009 Frontier (clutch from Frontier also). I got it running but it seems like the stock belt is too short or the clutches are in the same line. Has anyone done this swap?
If nothing else, does anybody know the offset distance from the mounting holes to the center of the clutch on a 23 and on a 16?
With further investigation, I am starting to think that the clutch that I have from the '09 Frontier may be too narrow to use the stock belt from my vanguard (125-56) because the Frontier takes a 127-159. Although I am having cross-reference issues with the 127-159, '06 Frontiers use a 127-137 which has a top width of 1.2" whereas my Vanguard2 stock belt has a top width of 1.4". The wider belt that I am trying to use must sit too high in the primary clutch, making it tighter than it should be (also perhaps the pitch of the clutch is different?). My question to everyone is for a shaft diameter measurement of:
2006 Argo Frontier 23hp output shaft diameter
2009 Argo Frontier 23hp output shaft diameter
early-mid 2000's bigfoot 18hp output shaft diameter
early-mid 2000's vanguard2 shaft diameter
I need to figure out what it is that I need for a clutch so that i can order it and use that for alignment before I weld in my new motor mount plate. Any measurements would be greatly appreciated....gotta get this going again!
I am swaping a 16 to 23hp in a Vanguard. What did you do with your exhaust? How did you do it?
Newfieguy: PM sent.
In regards to this thread about the belt problems, the issue has been resolved and swap will be complete soon. Turns out that the 2009 frontier 650 uses the new style transmission and motor/tranny orientation, so the belt is shorter, and also narrower. So with the factory clutch off the 2009, my stock 97 vanguard 2 belt would not work because it was too wide. I planned to find an original 16hp clutch and re-weight it, until i figured out that the original 16hp had a 1" shaft and the 23hp has a 1 1/8" shaft. In the end I found that a clutch for a 2002 (that style, older transmission), 8x8 conquest with a 20hp liquid kawi has 1 1/8" bore and is suitable for 20-25hp. Also, because it uses the same transmission setup as mine, the belt was the same width. Only modification needed was to drill out the center of the clutch to 7/16" to recieve the bolt for the 23hp (3/8 bolt for the 20hp kawi). Have now had the motor out about 3 times until I figured it out. Back to school now so it will have to wait a few weekends to get finished. Also installing a cage off a Polaris Ranger. Pictures to follow.
Does anyone have any tips on how to properly align the clutches for final assembly?
Great information, my 23 hp briggs has a 1" crank, so I will be using the clutch from the 16 hp. Do you think you will need to re- weight it? The engagment rpm and top rpm for both engines are the same. I realize the torque output is different, but wouldn't the clutch adjust accordlingly for this, as the fly weights are directly releated to rpm vs torque? Id be interested to test this.
If you post pics, can you take a few extra on the exhaust? I'd like to see how you have set it up. Mostly concerned with heat build up in the engine bay. The 16 i have now has the engine cooling air ducted and flowing past the exhaust , exiting to the outside. This keeps everything nice and cool under the hood.
Clutch alignment is not diffulcult, lots of good information on the skidoo forums. There are tools that you can buy for proper alignment, but i have been quite successful with a good metal straight edgs and vernier calipers. Use the back sides of the clutches for the flat surfaces. The straight edge will typically rest on the engine driven clutch on two points as far apart as possible (closest to the center), then extend outward to the driven clutch (again closest to the center. Take a measurement from the straightedge to the both points on the driven clutch to check for alignment and proper offset.
Hope this helps
Do you know what the proper offset would be? Basically I am rebuilding my engine mount because when I initially thought that it was clutch alignment I hogged out my motor mount holes to move it around (not too proud of that one). I am welding another plate to the top of that one with the correct size bolt holes and position, will just need to align the cluches before welding the new plate in, hence why I need the proper offset measurement.
Whatever model the engine driven clutch came off of I would use those measurements. Maybe someone will be kind enough to measure for you. Maybe the information is already in the forums somewhere. I wont be back to my place until Sunday...