We had one go also, sold by someone else, simple clip issue can be bad. The good is most all that are going to fail are used commercially with tracks like RD wrote, and the limited run before the improvement should have run it's course by now.
We had one go also, sold by someone else, simple clip issue can be bad. The good is most all that are going to fail are used commercially with tracks like RD wrote, and the limited run before the improvement should have run it's course by now.
The trans clip issue does not scare me away from a early avenger but it will stay in the back of my mind for a cost later down the road. I would not mind a 2007 and newer to get the updated trans and the bigger fuel injected motor but they do not seem to come up for sale as often as the early ones do. I have looked at many early avengers(2004 to 2006) and the prices are in my ballpark with Jim's machine being the one with the best upgrades and good price to boot.
Argo's are not all that common around here but knowing that the guys at Adair are only a two hour ride away I know I would be in good hands if the trans does decide to spit it's guts.
My collection: 2) attexes, 1) super swamp fox
Jim's machine is a good deal especially if you are interested in the options he has, some don't want or need what he has but if you're looking at something without them and want what he has it would cost about 6500-7500 to add them.
Hello Mike,
I have a 2005 Avenger that I purchased about 3 months ago. Is there a way to tell what type of transmission I have without taking it apart? Also, if possible can you post a photo with an arrow pointing at the problem area please? I live in Windsor, ON and ODG head office is only 3 hours away from me and they are useless. I have tried contacting them several times to get some information about my Argo and they always suggested contacting the dealer. As to the so called local dealers, they have no clue what I am talking about. BTW, there is a slight grinding / resistance when I try to engage the transmission. The engine appeared to be idling at around 1200 1300 rpm. Any help would be very much appreciated. Thanks for your time.
yes your idle is a few hundred too high. turn it down to the lowest idle that doesn't stall and shift in quickly from neutral. good luck
Hello,
Thanks for the quick reply. Any idea what the RPM should be at? I will try that.
Mike,
Did you have to get a new input shaft for the new style dog clutch? Or where you able to put the new style retaining clip on your existing shaft? I ask because when I went to get new gears I was directed that the shaft we have on our transmission has been superseded by a new part# 34-130. It looks like the only difference is the retaining clip, maybe a deeper or bigger grove?
Derek
Originally Posted by Mike
The first generation models had a clip on the input shaft of the transmission that can come loose. If that happens, it allows one of the forward gears to slide on the input shaft to where only the edge of the teeth mesh with the other gears. It can break the teeth. The newer models used a retaining ring to hold a clip in place to prevent this from happening. They also went from a three dog gear to a four dog for better durability. I think the change happened sometime in late 2006 or early 2007. My Avenger is a 2006 model and it had the older style transmission. I had the clip come off of my input shaft and it chewed up the gears.
I don't know how often this happened but it was obviously enough to necessitate a redesign. Just something to keep in mind. The transmission isn't difficult to upgrade to the new style retaining clip but if the teeth get torn up before you do the upgrade, you have to purchase several new gears because the three dog style are no longer manufactured so you have to upgrade both input gears and the center dog to the four ear style.
Here is a photo of my transmission. You can see the clutch dog and the two gears that have to be replaced:
I did not purchase a new shaft for the transmission but I still have the retaining clip laying on my desk, so I'm not sure if it fits or not. I put the transmission back together but did not have the right clip at the time. I was sent the wrong clip but didn't know it until I had everything back together. I was planning on replacing the clip once I was done with my T20 swap. I never finished that and my transmission has been sitting, waiting on me to put the right clip back in ever since. So, I really can't tell you. Maybe ask our forum sponsor and Argo dealer Doug from Fox Valley Argo?
Derek,
I installed the updated clip and thrust washer/retainer in my 2004 avenger transmission when had it apart this winter. I installed the 3.3 gears and was advised to go to the 4 dog style clutch and gears because the are supposed to be better than the 3 dog. Installing those would have required the new input shaft based on what the dealer told me. I believe because of the splines or something. I chose not to buy them. I bought Part #'s 107-14 Retaining Ring LC-125-PA and the 108-85 Washer, Retaining Thrust and they fit right on existing shaft. My 3 dog style clutch was in perfect shape so I'm comfortable that it will last.
After seeing the differences I have the opinion that the only thing wrong with the older style retaining ring is the hard shifting people that are on the end of the shift knob. I'm certain that with proper shifting there would be no problems, but if the shift knob gets hit, or shifted hard, I can see how the old style retainer could be pushed out of its fit. The new one is retained in its groove better, so it can take more abuse.
If your just wanting the 4 dog clutch, then from what I was told, you need the new input shaft too.
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote
