Buying new argo, transmission ponderings.

[Coast2Coast]

Has anyone been out testing the new LS transmission? Can the argo handle it? Could a guy still haul a moose with that transmission? They really push it on the huntmaster model as being a "revolutionary new transmission 25% faster". But the way my conquest struggles to turn with it's medium transmission I'd have to believe even a new machine would be useless with a transmission geared that high. But I'd hate to get the hi torque transmission and be stuck with walking speed everywhere I go if the new transmission can handle the heavy loads of hunting use and still have a bit of speed to get back to the staging areas, an hour down smooth cushy cut lines...

[mightymaxIV]

I just found out about the Huntmaster and read everything I could find. Both the HDI and the Huntmaster have the same towing capacity (1800 pounds). How ever the new Argo has a 25 mph top speed and they claim they have improved the steering (whatever that means). My 6x6 HD with the Admiral transmission would run 22 mph and my 8x8 HDI would run about 18 mph and those speeds were a little hairy so I hope they have really improved the steering if you want to run 25 mph in an 8x8.

Okay, lets say they really have improved the steering. The top speed would be nice on open trails and I am ASSUMING the low range is just as LOW? I always wanted a lower low range on my HDI so if the low range is good and the high range indeed pulls you to 25 mph it might be the best of both worlds but it seems to me there must be a compromise: some where?

I still think this machine needs a three speed transmission with 18 mph mid range, Low-low-low, low range and the 25 mph top end for open trails. But who am I? Oh just another man waiting for the right machine and a few minor improvements that would change the nature of the beast and make a good machine the "Best" machine.

[JohnF]

... But the way my conquest struggles to turn with it's medium transmission I'd have to believe ...

The LS is an upgrade to the triple differential transmission. The conquest has a single differential transmission. You can't infer performance of one by experience of the other.

The nature of the system in the conquest requires addition of power to make a turn (or it steals power and you lose thrust), the triple differential transmission does not have that requirement.

But I can't really answer your question either...

[Coast2Coast]

The LS is an upgrade to the triple differential transmission. The conquest has a single differential transmission. You can't infer performance of one by experience of the other.

The nature of the system in the conquest requires addition of power to make a turn (or it steals power and you lose thrust), the triple differential transmission does not have that requirement.

But I can't really answer your question either...

My understanding was that when you switch the admiral to low range it works pretty much the same as the old transmission, skid steering. But now the stopped wheels will turn backwards slowly. So I would think you'll still run into the same old problems with gearing.

If a new machine struggled and bogged turning like my conquest does I'd return it. Would sure like to take one for a test run. No dealers around here brave enough to demo one.

[JohnF]

My understanding was that when you switch the admiral to low range it works pretty much the same as the old transmission...

The open differential in the conquest transmission balances torque left/right. In a turn you balance the torque applied to the turning wheels by eating power in the brake on the opposite side.
The admiral transmission uses 3 planetary differentials to split the torque between left/right and does not eat power to turn.

...skid steering. ...

Technically they are both skid steer systems. The power loss you feel in the conquest happens in the brake, not at the tire/ground skid. If you have terribly grabby tires that take a great deal of power to skid a turn, the loss doesn't change by changing the transmission; that loss is between the tires and the ground.

I do think you need a test run. It's the only real way to find a system that fits your needs.

[mightymaxIV]

The Admiral steers or turns by slowing down one side and sending the drive to the other, turns on my Admiral equipped machines were effortless and I never felt a loss of power as I do on my 8x8 Frontier EFI.

Pertaining to low range, a light touch on the steering in low range will cause a gradual turn with out the counter rotation. Counter rotation requires and full lock down or a litter extra effort, I never liked the counter rotation part, it is good for control in the water but in deep mud the counter rotation requires massive power and over works the entire drive system causing belt squeal and other issues.

I have always said that Argo HDI's need to keep the low range and counter rotation separate. When I am in deep mud I want the low range. When I am in swampy water with fallen trees under the water a separate switch that allows me to go into low range with the counter rotation would work great. To me this is and has been an issue with the Admiral transmissions since they were built, (are you listening Argo?).

[Noel Woods]

Dan: I agree 100% with your observations. The Admiral Transmission would rule supreme in the AATV world if the counter rotation feature could be turned off. Its a tremendous/parasitic load to counter rotate the tires, and I believe the Argo Engineers put too much thought into it and I'm not really sure that the benefits while swimming really over-shadow the load issue in deep mud or sand. Had they just put an engagement switch on both sides of the steering handle to engage counter rotation, I think it would have been a superior product. I also feel that the new high speed Admiral, has got to have gear sets to allow it to get to that speed and not necessarily the low speed lugging gears that may be needed.

The three speed manual tranny, would be a great option, I don't think it would add much complexity.

[philipatmaxfour]

The Admiral steers or turns .....

I have always said that Argo HDI's need to keep the low range and counter rotation separate. When I am in deep mud I want the low range. When I am in swampy water with fallen trees under the water a separate switch that allows me to go into low range with the counter rotation would work great. To me this is and has been an issue with the Admiral transmissions since they were built, (are you listening Argo?).

Mighty Max, You are one of the unquestionable experts on Max and Argo machines in the mud and swamp. I really enjoy your videos and tend to hang on your every word because I know that you know what you are talking about. Please excuse me for being so pickey but do you mean "withOUT" in the above sentence..."separate switch that allows me to go into low range (with) the counter rotation...? because I hope that Argo are indeed listening.

[mightymaxIV]

Mighty Max, You are one of the unquestionable experts on Max and Argo machines in the mud and swamp. I really enjoy your videos and tend to hang on your every word because I know that you know what you are talking about. Please excuse me for being so pickey but do you mean "withOUT" in the above sentence..."separate switch that allows me to go into low range (with) the counter rotation...? because I hope that Argo are indeed listening.

What I mean is true low range on the gear selector (without counter rotation) and then to use the selector switch allowing the use of both the low range and counter rotation: meaning I only want the counter rotation when it is required, 80% of the time I want low range and low range only, the counter rotation feature would be activated by the selector switch and used only as necessary.

[philipatmaxfour]

Thanks for making that crystal clear Dan. You said in another post about pulling out stuck four wheelers that low range on the admiral tranny would be useful more often if you could turn off the reverse counter rotation. I agree on that and like your comments about an optional larger engine.