Low Speed = No Left Turn

[Cannibal]

Hey all.

I'm very new to the 6x6 world, but am enjoying myself immensely. I bought a bit of a beater, but I got a great deal and I like tinkering anyway. That said, my cup floweth over with ignorance about my Max II.

I've been working on the wiring, getting the hull patched for water-fun, installing a throttle, and replacing the first pair of tires/wheels. Been fun so far! But one thing is annoying. There has not been a throttle (working), so I've just been putting around in idle, which is fine. But not long after I got it, it sort of stopped turning left. I say "sort of", because sometimes it works. Almost never well enough to zero-point turn in that direction, but not a huge deal. Something to fix down the line.

Well now that the throttle is back to functional, it seems the turning is speed or rpm related. At speed, it is responsive in either direction. At idle, it makes long slow turns left. I was surprised when I had it about half way opened-up, and was able to slide turn to the left through the mud. Stupid kinds of fun, BTW!

So I guess I'm ready to start tackling some big-boy projects on this thing, like my steering issue. Does anybody have any ideas on where I should start? Springs attached to the sticks are fine. Nothing looks amiss with the chains or gears. The clutch is out of a snowmobile (hence the need for patching the hull), if that matters.

Any help would be appreciated and thanks in advance.

[philipatmaxfour]

Hey all.

I'm very new to the 6x6 world, but am enjoying myself immensely. I bought a bit of a beater, but I got a great deal and I like tinkering anyway. That said, my cup floweth over with ignorance about my Max II.

I've been working on the wiring, getting the hull patched for water-fun, installing a throttle, and replacing the first pair of tires/wheels. Been fun so far! But one thing is annoying. There has not been a throttle (working), so I've just been putting around in idle, which is fine. But not long after I got it, it sort of stopped turning left. I say "sort of", because sometimes it works. Almost never well enough to zero-point turn in that direction, but not a huge deal. Something to fix down the line.

Well now that the throttle is back to functional, it seems the turning is speed or rpm related. At speed, it is responsive in either direction. At idle, it makes long slow turns left. I was surprised when I had it about half way opened-up, and was able to slide turn to the left through the mud. Stupid kinds of fun, BTW!

So I guess I'm ready to start tackling some big-boy projects on this thing, like my steering issue. Does anybody have any ideas on where I should start? Springs attached to the sticks are fine. Nothing looks amiss with the chains or gears. The clutch is out of a snowmobile (hence the need for patching the hull), if that matters.

Any help would be appreciated and thanks in advance.

Hi Cannibal, The t20 trans. in your max 11 needs full braking one one side and lots of power on the opposite side to make sharp or as you say zero point turns. hence the need for a working throttle. Now That you seem to have the throttle working you will see that turns are easier on anything but dry pavement or concrete which require more air in the tires at the least and is better avoided. By the way I think that your max has prob. got a four stroke engine and your snowmobile clutch is prob. designed for a two stroke and much higher revs to lock up the clutch.

[Cannibal]

Hmmm, that sounds like a good path to go down. But why would the problem be limited to only one side and intermittent? Sorry if it's a dumb question, but this really is a new world to me.

[Rabbit929]

It could be dependent on how and when the clutch grabs. The only other thing you could look into is the bands for the t20.
If you pull your sticks back, and measure the amount of swing they have when you ten push them forward, should be between 4-8 inches. (Correct me if I'm wrong guys) I set mine to 5.5 inches of movement.

If your working on it, and it's a new machine to you, go ahead and pull the engine and trans. (Easier than you think) take the t20 and THOUROUGHLY dump out any old fluid. Replace it with dextrin mercron iv ATF, with a couple of need of limited slip additive (something compatible with synthetic oils) after you put it back in the machine.

It's safe to assume this thing most likely has oil in it older than the hills, and many accidentally put gear lube in, which will destroy your bands, hence ruining your braking power. If your bands are shot t, it's worth the time and money to rebuild, a new t20 is worth double its weight in gold, and is next to bullet proof when properly oiled.
It really comes down to what kindof machine you want for the money you spend, and me being a 4 stroke kindof guy, I say put the factory driven and driver in it with a red spring, and an engine with between 14-20hp. If you go above 18 horse, you will want to beef up you t20 mounts though, they tend to shear bolts in the higher powered machines.

I know I get carried away but in my opinion your problem is, in the order of likelyhood in my opinion;
-worn out/out of adjustment bands on one side
-poor/wrong oil in t20 transmission
-wrong clutching/sticky clutches

[Cannibal]

I was worried someone was going to suggest pulling that thing apart. Easier than I think, you say? Guess I'll start digging for a manual.

As far as the question about what kind of machine I want for the money I spent, it made me laugh a little. I have a bad habit of going all in. I'm not looking to build a racer, but I want something reliable and fun. I've got grand plans for accessories down the road, but I'm not big on dressing-up junk. I've got to get the guts right first.

The original drivetrain for my Max, is long since gone. It has a Duromax 18HP and what I was told was a snowmobile clutch. That's all I know about the clutch, other than they cut a hole in the hull (about the size of a nickel) to make room for it. Maybe blueprinting it is in order, but not sure I want to take that jump quite yet. I'm happy to spend some time and energy making what I've got work...for now, anyway.

Really do appreciate you folks' thoughts on this issue. It's in the realm of what my thoughts were centered on, but you guys have given me some specifics that I lacked. Thank you much!

[Rabbit929]

If money isn't an issue, and quality is a must, here's a must have list.

6x6parts.com
Max6x6.com
Richardsrelics.com
And buffalo bearings. (Look em up and call em for bearings)

The only 3 places you can get stuff, and check eBay often.

Your gonna want at least solid axles, if you wind up upgrading everyone seems to like the splined.
What it really comes down to when you buy a hammered out machine, go big or go home when it comes to fixing it up. It's pretty easy with the max line, everything is pretty simple. The hard part is getting good sprockets off when your trying to save em. So if you pull the whole top half, set it aside, pull all your chains and axles, install new bearings, sprockets if you need em, new chains, new throttle cable and choke cable, clean up engine and rebuild the tranny, your 90% new machine right there. I'll give you a list of suggested parts on the cheap.

Clutches, driven ($175) driver ($275-350) id put the right clutch in, just because I know nothing of the diffence with snowmobile clutches. I assume there's a reason most of us run the factory comets.
Buffalo bearings (about 110 bucks for 6 bearings with flanges if you got the 3 bolt like me)
Richards relics chain tensioners $220 (but SO worth it)
Chains depend where you get them from. Find out the year of your machine to find out what chains you. Red
Throttle and choke cable I believe we're around $80
T-20 bands and transmission rebuild will be the big costly one. The labor charge to pay a professional is very cheap, they can rebuild em in a couple hours. So if your concern is quality, have Richard or someone do it. It'll cost. Between $600-$1000
While you got all the axles out I'd pull the frame, fix broken welds and have someone powder coat it.

Also if you look in the how-to section here, it's got a lot of info. Richards website has a how-to for rebuilding the transmission from start to finish. This all may seem extreme, but what I did was evaluate what I have, adjust your chains, decide if those sprockets are shot, get it running and driving good enough to bounce it around the yard for a couple weeks, and begin ordering parts for an immense rebuild. Once it's rebuild, that's will be a beast of a machine for you for a long time.

[Cannibal]

Rabbit, that's a fantastic checklist and I thank you for it!

So the quick math says that for under $2,000, I can have a 90% new toy? I wouldn't say that money is no object, but I'm still several thousand ahead of buying a new machine and not having half of the fun learning as I go. That seems cheap, in a relative world anyway. Hell, it's almost gonna cost me more in rubber than mechanical. Reminds me of my CJ5.

I've found all of those sites, save Buffalo Bearings, already. I spend way too much time looking at the goodies and not at the actual parts I should be looking at for this thing. But now that you've provided me with a list of sorts, I'll shift the focus around...a little. Honestly the prices you've stated, are less than the goodies the wife already wants to get for it (tracks and snowplow). No point in having nice things, on top of junk.

[Rabbit929]

Yeah there's a lot of rigs for plows and what-not. When I get my shop done I hope to make one from scratch, straight blades you can get on eBay cheap. And yeah, the tires are one of the most pricy parts. Once you get the machine stripped down to nothing it's amazing the feeling you get once its back together.

The "built. Or bought" effect is stunningly irreplaceable. Lol

[garretttpe]

cannibal

last year i took my 2003 Max II and did a complete frame out overhaul, chains, all new sprockets and jackshafts, bearings, T-20 drums turned and relined bands, T20 split shift mod, high rev kit in the 18hp vanguard, tiny tach, a very loud horn using a push button on top of the control stick, 12v adapter for gps or any other things. a new windshield using scratch resistant poly for mcmaster- carr

All total the cost was a little over 2200.00 and it is a new machine. I have a post in here somewhere on the items I installed and all the venders I used. Plus that is a great way to truly know your machine.

larry