Help my Mudd-Ox sunk!

[thebuggyman1]

Attachment 8515Attachment 8514Attachment 8513Hi,
I have talked to Kurt and we are working on getting his machine up and running. He will be adding the float kit. The front float adds 350 pounds of floatation.

Matt

I need some help fast. After waiting over year for a mudd-ox after it was recommended by some folks on this site, my mudd-ox was finally delivered today. I bought two for a project that i am managing in Jamaica. One came with an aluminium cab and a 9.9 outboard but both was shipped sans the tracks, and the second was shipped without any of the accessories I had ordered. I wanted to test before taking it on a crocodile infested river. So i drove it on a beach in front of a house that I am renting. As it hit the water it just started taking on water, sunk and flipped sideways. I tried using the bilge pump but that eventually died. We used the second mudd-ox to drag it out of the water, but eventually the winch on the second ox died. The tires are locked and if they can run free we would be able to tow the thing home. Any suggestions? Can i remove the chains? or even slacken them? Pictures and more to come. I am very upset because matt had mentioned that it was unstable in water when he tested it and he attributed the lengthy delay to the fact that he was putting on a wider body so that it could float better. I am sure that he didn't do that and i am just glad they didn't come with the tracks and sank in the croc infested river. I have given up calling matt, he only seems to respond to text messages. But my phone died. I need some help pronto and to figure out a way forward (how to get the ox going again). But i am going to eventually throw away the aluminium top.
Any help or suggestions are welcomed!

Kurt

Did I misunderstand? I didn't think he sank, but tipped sideways and took on water instead. Does the front float add sideways stability too, or does he really need an outrigger type?

Kurt: Matt would not have put a wider HDPE (plastic) body on.....that tooling approches $100k , and for one machine, I can't see it happening. Matt does custom machines, and when I visited a couple months ago he had 2 larger (huge) machines with aluminum bodies. They looked nothing like the Mudd-ox machines we all know.

The 6 wheel ox (at least the first one) was an 8 wheel machine cut and spliced.....Maybe a wider one could be made that way, but you would have a seam down the middle.

[kmac]

Yeah we are discussing some options. It seems if the top (from where the base meets the top) of the ox could extend up to 6 inches it wouldn't be a problem. I was given some instructions to follow so i'm trying to get the water out of the engine as i type....

[philipatmaxfour]

I am surprised that your machine can withstand exposure to" SEA" water without damage. Are you sure that the axles and bearings will withstand the corrosive affects of salt?

[Bud]

I am surprised that your machine can withstand exposure to" SEA" water without damage. Are you sure that the axles and bearings will withstand the corrosive affects of salt?

My thoughts and concerns exactly. Having grown up on the Texas Gulf Coast, I know firsthand what kind of damage salt water can do.

[Bazooo guy]

Stainless steel everything...$$$$$$$$$

[kmac]

Ahhhhhh after i get it working again, then i'll tackle that....

[gearhead]

My 2006 ARGO avenger 8x8 I have took swimming with me and my 3 kids and use it as a raft and diving off platform on numerous occasions on Lake Ontario I can climb back in the ARGO from deep water stepping in the rim as a step and it takes on no water from the side! I am amazed at the stability of the AVENGER and now with the new ARGO tires I can acually pull the kids around on a floating mattress fast enough they can have fun.I will see if I can find some pics or video from past rides and post them here or doubleclucker channel on youtube.

[LarryW]

Here is a video of one swimming and another of my attex 8x8 swimming.

[kmac]

Post removed by Mike

Well it is too early to tell if it is inferior. I took the second ox sans any additional equipment on the sea, and it floated. A little un-nerving but it floated. I've spent a lot more on other equipment that were DOA before; the trick is to figure out how to make it work for you. And I will tell you this..i have spent much more on a piece of equipment that is much riskier to use than the ox. But they serve a purpose and if they work i will be eternally grateful. The ox was bought to solve a problem..i need to get to very remote sites and i needed a diesel engine because it should be more efficient and so that i didn't have to haul gas around. An aussie mate recommended using an ATV given the problems we had with site access. I did some research on the ATVs (over six months) and I came across the argos but most users complained profusely about the chains, and the uncertainty with the chains popping if they are not properly serviced etc. Also, there is an issue with the engine mounted to the front. I considered a hyrotraxx, but the design hasn't been updated in ages and it is much more expensive. The triton was much too expensive, so was the hyratrek. I liked the hyratrek because it had a propulsion system on water, but the cost to kit it up was too much. Plus I think it's too heavy for where i work and i have a problem with the approach angle of the front. I needed something fairly cheap, and one that could be modified. The folks on this site recommended the ox. It's cheap enough (relatively speaking) so that i could buy two in case one dies ( i had a nightmare about this), i can either have another one to tow or come fetch. And to be honest, 25k is a lot, but it is better spending on something that dies than on something much more expensive that dies. Also a single diesel atv from the other manufactures that offer a diesel engine, is the price of two diesel oxs. You have to go for that two for one special!

The sea route is one access route which is much faster -- along the coast up the river to sites where we can then get on the marsh land and go to where ever we need to go. That will take 1.5 - 3 hours. My idea with the ox is to take a b-line through the marsh from our field station (will take up to four hours) and use it to go up and down the river to conduct acoustic surveys, among other things -- hence why we asked to fit a 9.9 hp outboard motor to the unit. I would prefer to use this route in the future because we may have to access our sites during rough weather or during a hurricane. So the pontoon is out of the question and it's extra money for something that is too specialized. So when the tracks arrive and when we take it out in the marsh, if it fails to get to the sites then i can say i got no performance out of them. But if it works it would be best of the bunch..in terms of price point and what i want.

But you might find this strange, but i am optimistic and happy that it failed NOW and not later (especially with some expensive equipment on board although we might have lost one with the sinking)! Although we all would have preferred if it didn't sink, i got the chance to pull the engine down, so i am more confident about solving mechanical issues. But it's not like there was a mechanical issue with the ox (well not yet) and i think we have some ideas on how we can solve the flotation issue. I'll tell you this, maybe i don't know much about ATVs but it is a hardy little bugger. 3+ hrs underwater (salt water) and i managed to get the thing started with relative ease and the engine is turning over. The electrics need sorting out, the headlight is still flooded with water but the damn thing still lights up when the ignition is switched on, and all electrical devices are working (included the headlights). SO that is an A+++ in my books. Anything that i can fix, i have to be happy with. I don't want anything with complicated mechanics. But you might see me back here crying for more help so all this accolade may be premature. But it's not too bad. So apart form the problems i had with the matt..i am still optimistic it may work..if it doesn't i'll post something and use it as an expensive paper weight. Even then it still won't be inferior..just an expensive way to keep my papers from flying around.....

[mudbug3]

Kmac

Did you check to see if any water was in the oil before you tried to start the engine? If so ,did you drain the oil several times until you saw no more water residue in the oil? I did'nt see a mention about this in your latest post.