Argo vs. Max vs. ?

[Roger S]

We need to remember that everyone has a different idea of what "use" is. The two stroke guys like relativly smooth terrain where they can open it up. My group is a boondock crew of ripping up the skid plate over rock ledge and knocking down trees. Some ranchers and farmers mount a fifth wheel in their Avenger for their trailers. Whipper has evolved mind boggling comfortable long distance desert runners.

As for speed, when we get on a main trail, everyone seems to run wide open without a problem if they want to.

[RKlingborg]

as for speed of an Argo mine is guverend to 23 mph, I manged to go 24mph for a shot while going down a steep hill. The tires on the Frontier stick to the conceit like glue and you have to prety much give it full throutle to turn, but talking to the tech at the Argo dealer, some one warout one side by doing dounuts.

[wommy]

Why I bought Max was 90% the tranny. I took the Argo for a number of test runs, each time found I could not do a smooth turn, had to jerk the levers, even with the Avenger. I was told by the dealer that to ease the brakes would severely overheat them. So, on the longer trips, very uncomfortable. 6X6 don't run dead straight, and nor do the tracks, so requiring many small corrections, with Argo they have to be jerks. With the Max a slight pull on one lever gives a gentle sweep turn, long as you like. Back further to braking point and the turn gets quicker, pull to the point of full lockup and do a 360. Brake a bit quick down a steep grade and a 6X6 Argo WILL endo, guaranteed, not sure about the 8 wheelers. I am getting used to my Max over time, but I still far prefer the looks of either Argo, the 8X8 Avenger really looks great. I did wait for the Avenger to come out before I made my choice, hoping the "new" transmission as they called it with T bar would solve the problem. As it was a while ago, I don't remember, can you brake both sides with the handlebar?. For mine it has to be the T20, or whatever the Hoot system is for really comfortable aatv-ing.

[kovac]

I do agree with you on the long trips. It was much easier to make slight adjustments with the max. I have to make many jerky corrections with my avenger. but other than that the avenger is much more comfortable.

[mightymaxIV]

I do agree with you on the long trips. It was much easier to make slight adjustments with the max. I have to make many jerky corrections with my avenger. but other than that the avenger is much more comfortable.

I must agree with the steering comments. I test drove an Argo frontier and though it was a beautiful vehicle but I did find that it was hard to control and I kept thinking about how every imput on the handlebar was causing a braking action to the left or right side and causing a loss of six wheel drive. I came home and drove my Max around the yard a couple of times and found that it was much easier to control with a combination of stick and throttle and really much more enjoyable to drive. I do love the ground clearance on the frontier and wish that RC would go to work updating their machine by lowing the engine, putting the t-20 under the back seat, spreading the wheel base out a little and designing the machine for more ground clearance. I also wish they would put a high and low range on the Max for extreme conditions. If you could lower the center of gravity on a MaxIV and get the ground clearance up to 12" along with about 6" more wheelbase (better ride more back seat room-bigger tires) you would have a machine with no equal! Please RC, make me happy!!!!!! While I am dreaming, why not make a 27", 12 inch wide four ply version of the Argo Frontier tire-add a smooth bottom to the Max and you now have a vehicle no one else can touch! Come on rc, get with the program!!!!!

[George]

I I do love the ground clearance on the frontier and wish that RC would go to work updating their machine by lowing the engine, putting the t-20 under the back seat, spreading the wheel base out a little and designing the machine for more ground clearance. I also wish they would put a high and low range on the Max for extreme conditions. If you could lower the center of gravity on a MaxIV and get the ground clearance up to 12" along with about 6" more wheelbase (better ride more back seat room-bigger tires) you would have a machine with no equal! Please RC, make me happy!!!!!! While I am dreaming, why not make a 27", 12 inch wide four ply version of the Argo Frontier tire-add a smooth bottom to the Max and you now have a vehicle no one else can touch! Come on rc, get with the program!!!!!

Mike or Jeff,

Either of you guys know whether or not the folks at RI or ODG monitor this site? I've heard these suggestions close to 10 years now (on other sites). I'd think they'd see these forums as free market research.

[hydromike]

Jeff can certainly add to my rant, and probably for good reason. I can't be sure that a lot of decision makers at RI monitor the Site. I certainly don't know the inner-workings of the company, so all I can say is from observation, and from speaking to a few of the folks there.

They (RI) seem very, very complacent with their current products, and not a whole lot of changes have been made in a long time. The Max II and IV have certainly seen their share of much needed upgrades, but a drastic change in either driveline or the body itself has yet to be seen. I guess one could certainly argue that both models work extremely well. Granted, engine choices have certainly improved over the years, and with the introduction of EFI in the Avenger, and liquid cooled models of both the Max IV and Argo models (not sure which you can get liquid in... just the Avenger?), it certainly shows that someone is interested in improving something. There just seems to be a lot of "inside-the-box" thinking that I, personally, think could be put to a test. Without a lot of competition in the market (There are really only two competitors), there isn't much of a catalyst for change. There's really no "oneupsmanship" in the amphibious ATV industry. I would certainly like to see a drastic change in either of the manufacturers that is grand enough to stand the other on its ear. The thing is, extensive R&D is expensive, and when there's little DEMAND for the change, that expense likely does not seem fruitful.

Personally, (no big surprise coming from me...) I would love to see a machine that's capable of 55mph off the showroom floor. It's not difficult. It's not extremely expensive. Sure, a springer would be amazing, and most of the R&D for a couple machines has been performed. Would RI buy the idea from Whipper? Probably not. Why? The attitude of the manufacturers isn't in performance, unfortunately. But the EXACT MINUTE that RI throws a 50-60 horsepower, 55mph capable Max on the market, you can be sure that the Argo guys are going to be hitting the AutoCAD pretty hard.

There just needs to be a catalyst. What will that take? Who knows.

~M

[McCoy]

Here are my two cents worth. I have a 2006 Bigfoot with the hadlebar type steering and I love the machine. Yes, it's jerky and looses tons of power when I turn, but, for me and how I use it, it was the right choice. I have ridden Mike's Max II and absolutely loved it. I would love to have one myself. However, being the shortlegged little rascal that I am, having nothing to brake my feet against made me rather uncomfortable. Also, alot of the time, I have my 2 year old daughter riding with me and have to drive with only one hand and I couldn't do this with a T-20. Many times, I have three people riding in the front seat and the argo steering is still fairly comfortable even with me sitting all of the way to the right. I also like having the engine in front of me. That's not to say that if I rode by myself all of the time, I wouldn't like to have a Max II or an Attex, because I would like to have one of both. But for me the Bigfoot works great. I guess it all boils down to which machine suits a persons needs and wants the best. I don't think that one particular machine is the be-all, end-all top dog of AATV's. They all have their perks and downfalls. It's just which one is right for you.

McCoy

[Roadtorque]

Seems like all this talk is about transmissions. So, transmission aside who has the better built machine? On a different point I think argo is "one up" due to its look alone.

[Mike]

Wow, where did this post get dug up from? I think this was one of the first on the site.