Argo Sputtering Occasionally

[Xplicit]

Argo # 1 - Its a 2009 Avenger EFI @ about 600hrs. It seemed to sputter a bit when at full throttle. We had seen the in-line fuel filter was a little bit dirty so we changed it out. Almost immediately after that, the fuel pump failed (began to draw fuel at a much slower rate), so we replaced that, and the next cylindrical fuel filter after that. With the new pump on, there is a much better throttle response, and overall power to the argo. Though it still sputters and burps occasionally when at high rev.

Does anyone have a suggestion on what I should try? Possibly a fuel line anti-freeze with a water dissolver or whatever its called?

Argo #2 - 2008 Avenger EFI @ 280 hrs. - I wasn't having any troubles with this argo until I decided to change the in-line fuel filter, as you can imagine... With the new filter on, the filter is only about 3/4 full ,with an air bubble in the filter, when driving it around it seems to be under powered like it isn't getting the full amount of fuel it needs. I've never seen two fuel pumps die from changing an in-line filter. In this case though, Argo #2 is still usable with slowed fuel rate, unlike Argo #1.

Should I just go ahead and order a second fuel pump, or is there something else anyone can suggest I try. Would blowing on the fuel pump in reverse flow direction do anything for improving fuel flow?

Thanks a ton,
X

[msafi65]

If your Argos have the inline filter before the pump they should have an open pickup tube in the tank. 2010 ?? On up have a strainer screen in the tank and I've been having to clean them quite often. Drill out the seat storage box rivits careful not to punch through the fuel tank and remove the box. The drop tube just pulls out part way then pry out the grommet. I've had to remove a few of the screens and install a low pressure filter before the pump. Reinstalling is easy, start with the grommet part way on the tube insert into tank with WD-40 or some lube. Work grommet into tank then push tube in. I've cut up a few pumps to see why they failed. Walbro rates the pump for 2000 hours. I've replaced several at less than 100 hr. The pump has an internal screen that cannot be cleaned and inlet and outlet check valves. You can't blow backwards through one. Pressure testing under load is just about the only way to find out if it's starving for fuel. They need 45 lbs of pressure minimum to run good. If they loose 5 psi top end is poor and 7-10 down and idle gets rough. I ran one last summer for days with a gauge on it before finding the tank strainer plugged. Good luck the pumps aren't cheep.

[Noel Woods]

It may just be related to fuel, the ethanol blends today start breaking down at 30 days. Try draining the fuel and go with a non ethanol type. Marinas and a few gas stations still sell it, although its priced above mid grade.

Worse case scenario, just try mid grade gas, my 08 Frontier with the 23hp B&S, hates regular, but runs well with the higher grades and non-ethanol gas.

[Nubs]

Ethanol mixed gas is bad stuff in small engines that sit for a few months at a time.

[Xplicit]

The strainer in the tank seems to be clean, on argo # 2. I get alot of fuel easily up to the fuel pump, the fuel pump is a little noisy, it has been for a while, i assume it is getting weak. I wish there was a way to prolong the life of fuel pumps, as I feel I will inevitably changing out the fuel pumps on both our Argo's this week...

We are switching to higher grade gas too.

Thanks for the help!

X

[watpress]

This is a long shot and probably doesn't pertain to your situation, but it might to others. I have an old Argo that was occasionally experiencing sputtering. If I opened up the needle valve on the carb a bit, it would clear and then be normal for awhile. I tried changing the fuel filter, cleaning the carb, etc. etc. but it still randomly sputtered. One day I decided to pull the fuel line right at the carb to see if there was any constriction. As I pulled the hose away, a long thread from the fuel line pulled out along with it. It seems that the fuel line was breaking down internally and pieces were jamming up the carburetor. Changed the fuel line and that solved that problem.

Recently I changed the fuel filter in the old gal and immediately started experiencing sputtering. I pulled off the fuel filter on the carb side and sucked on it a bit and noticed air coming up. Looked at the other side and saw a small crack where the fuel line was attached to the fuel filter causing it to suck air. Cut off a half inch of fuel line, hooked it back up and now it's good to go!

[frenchconxion]

Guys I maybe stating the obvious but cleaning the carb may be an idea. I had small crystals from old fuel form in my carb on the chainsaw that caused similar high rev sputtering and difficulty when starting. Just my two cents worth

[Xplicit]

Update

Hi again fellas. We seem to be still having the same problem. It was acting up in the bush. It seems to run fine for a few hours but when it gets hot it starts to sputter, sounds like only one cylinder is running. we changed plugs and checked almost everything. Could it be the coil causing these problems? its a 2009 argo avenger 750EFI. one of the spark plugs is only about 3/4 of the way in. Im sure that wouldn't help? I figured if that was what was causing it, then it would sputter all the time and not intermittently? Any advice is appreciated, it doesnt seem to be the fuel or lines we have changed almost everything out.

[msafi65]

I had one that was dropping one cylinder at times and was the push on connecter at one coil. Was just a bit loose hasent done it again since cleaning and crimping to tighten up.

[Rickb]

Hello All,

I find this thread very interesting as I have been having similar issues with my 2009 Avenger 750EFI.....I replaced the fuel filter and the fuel pump died immediately after.....Is this just coincidence, or what???

I just ordered a new fuel pump (big $$), but I really want to know what caused the original pump to die so early in it's life.....this ARGO only has 55 hours on it???? The only thing I can think of is bad, gummed up gas clogging the internal workings in the pump due to not much use over the last 5-years??? I just bought this ARGO, so I do not know how well the previous owner maintained it.

I took out the fuel pick-up tube from the tank and I was surprised to see the newer black tube with the fine screen/spring on the bottom.....I was surprised because this ARGO also has the in-line low pressure fuel filter located between the tank and the fuel pump.....I thought it would be one or the other based on the ARGO service bulletin??? ......this has left me more confused.

Do you think I should follow the new service bulletin and get rid of the inline low pressure fuel filter, or should I put one back in???? Although it does seem like overkill since there is a high pressure fuel filter downstream of the pump, I kinda like having the second filter as extra protection from today's crappy gas. I am just thinking that perhaps it is the low pressure filter that is causing the pump failure???

I would appreciate input from anyone out there on this confusing problem????

Is there any way to talk with the boyz at ARGO (ODG) directly for weird stuff like this????

Cheers, Rick

[JohnF]

I would get rid of the screen in the tank and keep the inline filter. It's just easier maintenance.

[Rickb]

Do you think the filter could be damaging the pump?? Is that why argo suggests to remove it??

[plott hound]

did you ever figure this problem out

Xplicit?my 750 HDI started dropping a cylinder at low and high speed.

[wern]

I also experienced a pump failure at 100 hours.We do not have "crappy" gas here in NZ., so gumming up is not an issue.The replacement pump from Kohler which I purchased is a different and supposedly improved model.
Here's hoping.

[Rickb]

Update on my 2009 Avenger 750EFI:

I just replaced the "stock" Walbro fuel pump.....I paid way too much from ARGO......can get it much cheaper online directly from Walbro......I already had it ordered so no deal for me !!

Here's a list of the other stuff I did to this machine:

1. Replaced the brake blower fan.....all internal fins were ripped off??.....I also found out the hard way that it is way cheaper to go direct to Jabsco for this fan than purchase at ARGO;
2. Pulled the fuel tank - cleaned it - reinstall....friggin nightmare job....I don't get frustrated easy but that job was just not right....I would not recommend it....I would drill a hole in the bottom and install a valve next time....has anyone done this...I know that I will have to flush her out again some day.....bad fuel here!!
3. Replaced the EFI (steel) fuel filter...buy from Napa or other third party...once again, way overpriced at ARGO;
4. Installed bush bar from ARGO....I would say worth the $$....I wouldn't hang the ARGO from it, but it seems solid....andlooks cool;
5. Did a lot of re-wiring......bilge switch died, and lights were touch and go......I would appreciate any information on recommended switches and overall electrical upgrades....I just wanna keep it simple, reliable, and easy to trouble shoot and repair if I am deep in the bush;
6. Replaced some fuel line and the pick-up to the tank......some of it was already breaking down....crazy after only 5 years????....again bad fuel??
7. Based on #6, I want to replace the fuel line from the steel filter to the engine.....I would like some help here regarding how to route this line.....it seems that I would have to split the beast open??? Also, can someone comment on whether 50 psi rated 5/16 fuel line is sufficient, or do I have to deal out big bucks for EFI specialized fuel line???

After all that she seems to run well......I have not had time to take her for a long run yet...so not 100% sure.

....next projects include installing warn winch and replacing the throttle cable.......anyone here have advice on cleaning the throttle linkages????....mine seem to be all gummed up and stick sometimes.....is there a cleaner and/or lube that is good here??

I hope this helps!!

....and I would really appreciate input on the above embedded questions.

Cheers, Rick