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  • #1

    Bearing problem..??

    Just picked up a Response 8x8..Noticed a little play in three wheels. Figured outer bearing..No problem..Removed the axle and the bearings seem decent no movement. It appears that the set screws filed off and the inner bearing casings were moving on the shaft and has worn the shaft on at least two of the axles. Has anyone seen this..If I replace these bearings will I have the same problem especially now that the shafts are worn. The bearings are loose on the shaft until I set the set screws. What could have caused this and how can I avoid this in the future..

    Thanks
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  • #2
    I've seen it on axles and jack shafts. Have the axles repaired at a machine shop by welding and then turning on a lathe.

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    • #3
      Axles can be fixed, but before I did that I would measure the axle diameter just to see if it needs it. You could also just slide a new brng on the shaft to see how it fits. I have noticed a few times that I had to replace brngs, due to a little wiggle in the shaft, and when I pull the axle the brng "seems" to be fine but I replace it anyway and the wiggle is gone. Even when the brng seems good it can be worn, or sometimes the brng housing is worn, cracked, or loose.
      As for the brng setscrews, I just take them out and throw them away. I've never had a problem with the inner brng race spinning on the shaft, unless the brng failed in some way. If the brng fails, the setscrews wont hold it anyway, they will just damage the shaft as they grind around.
      I'm kinda picky about my axle brngs, and replace them at the first sign of failure. If I can't get the "wiggle" out with a couple shots of grease, the brngs are changed out.

      If you decide not to replace this shaft, I would put it back in the Argo, 2nd from the back, as this is the axle that takes the least amount of abuse in my experience.

      Just my 2 bits, although some will probably disagree with me

      RD

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      • #4
        The loose bearing on shaft deal is thanks to argo's poor tolerance and soft axle steel. The fit varies from axle to axle/ bearing combination, how thick the paint is, etc.

        Another option is to interchange any of your 6 rear axles with the two fronts, which have bearing extension housings which locate the bearing in a different spot on the axle.
        To Invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. (Thomas Edison)

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        • #5
          Originally posted by rocksavage View Post
          The bearings are loose on the shaft until I set the set screws. What could have caused this and how can I avoid this in the future..

          Thanks
          Most of these problems could be avoided if the manufacturers didn't use such soft steel for axles. They all seem to use cheap low grade Peer bearings made in China.
          As for welding the axles, in my opinion, it's usually a waste of time. Depending upon what the axle is made out of, it will do one of two things. It will either anneal the axle & make it softer than it already is, or crystallize it & make it hard & brittle. And then there is the problem of grinding it back to size for the proper fit for the inner race. I agree with Rock Doctor about the set screws on the inner race. I don't use that kind of bearing. In my opinion, the best bearing to use is a Timken (Fafnir) with an extended inner race & a cam loc. I know some people don't like the cam locs, but if you underst
          and how they work & don't lock them so tight, they work great. It's just a better way of locking the inner race to the axle. And if they are locked in the right direction, they won't come loose. The extended inner race gives more support for the axle. The one place not to cut corners on these machines if you can afford to is on the axles & bearings. If you use the cheapest stuff, then it will always be a hi maintenance vehicle. Use the best stuff & you get to play a lot longer.
          I just recently ordered bearings for the MAX IV Springer project & for whatever reason, they sent me Peer bearings. I'm sending them back & now waiting on the Timken bearings, because I refuse to use the Peer bearings. So right now the Springer is delayed another week.
          I guess what I'm trying to say is, put it together right with GOOD axles & GOOD bearings & you'll have a lot less problems.

          Whipper

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          • #6
            Just wanted to show the difference between a standard bearing & an extended inner race bearing. You can see the extra support an axle would have.

            Whipper
            Attached Files

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            • #7
              Whipper,
              Where do you get your bearings? You only use the extended race bearing on the inside bearing correct? I have never changed any of my bearings yet but I have one that I think I'm going to change. I don't need to loose a bearing or have a issue while out in the wild of Alaska.

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              • #8
                Argos have a pretty wide inner race, if the bearing is a tight fit when installed it usually stays tight. Maybe Jerry Nuss can send you some bearings or share his source.
                To Invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. (Thomas Edison)

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                • #9
                  I just realized that all the bearings that I purchased for my max were A&L made in china. they do appear to have a little more extension on the inner race than the one on the left in Whipper's photo. Hope they hold up because I'm about to install them right now.

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                  • #10
                    You can get the bearings thru a local bearing house. Don't worry about the bearings, Mike. Use what you got . They'll be alright for a while.

                    Whipper

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                    • #11
                      bearing problem

                      Can anyone tell me the brand and number for good bearings for an argo? Something made in North America. I am replacing some in my early 80's machine and I don't want to have to get the Chinese ones the dealer sells. The number on the one I removed is nsk en206dr . Thanks Gregg
                      Gregg V

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                      • #12
                        Thanks to all who provided insight on this one..Wow this forum is a wealth of information and advise..It appears that original owner did not grease the outer bearings as it probably took too much time to remove the wheels.. Bearing seized and damaged the axle..Anyway I have replaced inner and outer with new seals now on 6 of 8 wheels and will finish up when more parts arrive..I swapped out the worn shaft with a front axle as the bearing sits in a different location due to the axle extensions(thanks Roger s). This was a simple and most importantly economical fix..They will certainly be greased in the future..

                        Those bolts on the inner front axles bearings are not the easiest to work at..

                        Thanks to all..

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by greggv2007 View Post
                          Can anyone tell me the brand and number for good bearings for an argo? Something made in North America. I am replacing some in my early 80's machine and I don't want to have to get the Chinese ones the dealer sells. The number on the one I removed is nsk en206dr . Thanks Gregg
                          WHat did you end up using?

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