Open letter to the Engineers and Executives at ARGO ODG

[mightymaxIV]

Open letter to the Engineers and Executives at ARGO ODG

Wanted: Argo Frontier 6x6 with suspension seats, the admiral transmission with low range counter rotational ability, the thirty-one horse power water cooled, fuel injected, Kohler engine, 1 3/8 inch heavy duty axles with heavy duty axle bearings and front and rear wheel bearing extensions, 25 inch Argo swimming tires, front bush guard with a winch. (I assure you I will need the winch) (Yellow please)

If you will build this vehicle and bring it to my home I will gladly pay you a $12,000.00 reward for building and delivering the vehicle every AATV enthusiast on the planet is waiting for you to build!

I will test said vehicle in the most extreme mud and swamp conditions I can find and will give you a full written and video report on my findings. You will get someone who will test your prototype Frontier and will pay for the privilege. (What more could you ask for)

In addition to testing the Argo with your new swimming tires I will purchase a set of 26x12x12 Outlaw tires and fit them on new 12 inch bead lock K-rims.

I will then put the toughness of your new axle and bearing system though a dramatic set of tests which will include taking said vehicle to ATV parks throughout the Southeast and testing said machine against the biggest badest high lifted, high dollar Quads and Side by sides I can find.

When I am finished your vehicle will have been through every bad swamp and ATV Park I can find and will have received a very demanding test by an acknowledged AATV advocate.

I await your response to this correspondence.

THX

[Bw6]

Will That Be Cash or Check?

Well Dan, You better get your reward money ready, because Argo will be testing several Admiral equipped Frontiers at one of the meanest ATV events in Ontario! I'm not sure if they will have the 31 EFI or the 23 Vanguard, but everything else will be there. Argo ODG will be at this event "enforce" with about 10 Argo's riding in this grueling event. Argo is seriously going after the ATV/UTV market and this is the premier event to do it.

The 2010 Springjam ride goes for 3 days starting on April 29 to May 1, with different rides depending on your ability. The "Georgian Rocks" 6 hour ride was brutal. We put 2 Hoots in that ride in 2007 and almost destroyed them, we DNF, and had to do major repairs on the trail. So these are excellent proving grounds for the Frontiers!

Can-Am Spring Jam 2010 Canada's Largest ATV Jamboree

[Roger S]

Here's my idea. A factory 23 hp frontier. Add a set of 25" argo tires on Mudd Ox 9" wheels. Let me build the 23 briggs to a conservative and dependable 30-45 HP. DONE.

No need for suspension seats as the frontier has a good deep foam seat, and Matt's wheels will hold a tire on the bead with 0 psi. They won't get knocked off by cypress knees. No need for heavy 12" wheels and avt mud tires that take 5 psi to keep them mounted in the cypress. No need for a heavy water cooled engine adding weight to the front heavy argo. No need for the Admiral trans in the little 6x6 with lots of HP. No need for tougher axles with the factory extensions and low psi tires.

Just an idea..

[mightymaxIV]

BW-6 Roger

BW6: I am happy that Argo will be testing upgraded versions of the new Frontier-Thank God! However my offer is sincere, they will need the machine tested under real world conditions by real people under extreme conditions and I assure you that they will not find anyone who will put there machines under more extreme conditions than me. I have about ten impossible places waiting for the right machine and I believe the Frontier is the machine that could conquer most of these conditions. I would certainly like to try. The ability to counter rotate off of logs under the mud or under water is a very big deal in my area and it is a stopper more times than you can imagine-The other stopper is cypress knees just under the water level that you can't see-The light weight of the Frontier and the ability to rock and slig mud and water would help in these situations.

Roger: I would agree with you on the engine. A souped up Briggs would be lighter and would do the job better in most areas. If the engine sounded like Meinfields 50 horse Briggs it would probably scrare away every Quad and four wheeler within a fifty mile radius.

However: I don't agree with you on the axles or the transmission. I want this best axles and bearings I can get because they are going to see a lot of abuse!
Pertaining to the Transmission: I have seen you do miracles with the current skid steer transmission but I hate the way it sends drive to the wheels on the non braking side. I want a true six wheel drive transmission with the ability to counter rotate in low range.

Now I know that there are several non believers out there that say the counter rotation is not a big deal but i can tell you that it is a big deal when you are dealing with logs under the mud or under water. Your tires under these conditions will follow the log and send you right toward a tree.

The best example of this is the last Big Creek video i posted. Both Lee and had were in very bad mud-a log under the mud kept pushing us toward a tree. Neither of us could work off the tree and we both had to back out of the hole. A very small counter rotation would have brought either one of us off that log and put us going in the right direction. I encounter these logs and under water cypress kness in my area constantly! Under these any every other condition I want true six wheel drive and the ability to counter rotate.

Pertaining to rims and stock tires- I agree the Matt O. rims are the way to go and in swamps and trail conditions the stock tires would be the way to go.
B]However :[/B] I also know the for the type of extreme mud that i run into at Doles, Big Creek, and several conditions here within Miles of my house, under these conditions nothing would beat a set of Outlaws-but up until now there hasn't been a 6x6 that could take the abuse these tires could dish out. I believe the new Frontier could handle a set of these tires and can tell you from watching many machines in the mud that the stock 25 inch Argo tire would not move in this type of mud with out water-wouldn't move period! Outlaws would! I know you would Argue but the stock tires would not move in this heavy duty mud.

Anyway: ODG-when do I get my test mule?

THX Dan

[mightymaxIV]

BW6-your hoots were awesome, to bad you didn't have one with Frontier tires for this event!

[mightymaxIV]

Roger

Roger, this is an example of the type of mud that i am talking about. A Frontier with an Admiral transmission and a set of 26x12x12 Outlaws would make this hole a non-issue.

[Bw6]

Dan, your right about that mud, we don't have that stuff up here. But we do have floating muskeg, loon ****, and lots of black muck swamps. In most of these cases the new Argo tires do quite well. Looks like we won't find a "one size fits all" solution, as each area requires local knowledge, that's what makes our hobby so interesting.

Yes, it's too bad we didn't have those 24" Frontier tires on the Hoot's, we only found about them later on. When we installed those 24" tires we couldn't believe the difference it made. In our area any size of RHIII's are useless. I'm learning a lot running those 30" XXL Mudlites on BWII. Mainly buy #60 HD chain by the 100' roll, and axles by the dozen, LOL. I also have my T-20 apart inspecting for damages. The torque also sheared the output sprocket welds on the clutch side (welded not knurled). You pay a price running large aggressive tires!!!

[mightymaxIV]

BW6- I am with you, I believe that tallest tire you can safely run on a 6x6 is 26" because of the Torque and stress they put on axles. Ground clearance is king, but with it comes a price that has to be paid. A smooth slick bottom that you can drag in the mud with an agressive tire seems to be the answer. Quads get the ground clearance without the big tires and I have several solutions for a 6x6 if i had the money and time to play with different configurations.

Believe me I understand the conditions you run in Canada from watching videos you and others have posted. The old videos you posted of the hoot in the swamp and Muskeg were some of the best. Wish you would post them again since Hoot is now out of Business. They were really fun to watch!