Need some experienced advice

[MIteyMT]

Here's the hot topics on my 83 argo 8x8

Roll pins: pulled them, going to grade eight bolts, thanks for all the tips

Tires: Closer observation revealed that my argo rims had no change in diameter at all on the inboard bead, and that with low pressure, that is why they were always coming off. I am purchasing old Max wheels that have a "popping" bead on both sides, and I think I am going to selftap screw the beads as well, I really want to be done messing with tires

Tracks: I have been cautioned by my local guy not to put tracks on my argo because it is a shearpin type older argo. It is also 16 horse tecumseh. I keep looking at the simple tracks that amphicat built, and thinking they look doable. I need some help here. I need some pictures of bearing cage ideas. I also have enough snowmobile track available to make a set that way, really need help hear. Should I just give up on tracks, or try some conveyor belt and chain ones like amphicat, or make some with snowmobile track. Which chains should I disconnect on this 8x8

Well, those are the biggies, except for how to mount this outboard motor I bought. If you are laughing at me, I am ok with that

[Robinhood02]

hi there; heres my two cents on the track thingy, I run grade 8 bolts as well but this leads to the holes slotting out and over time you need to weld them closed and redrill them to take the slack out, but more importantly i run only the front 3 axles on tracks leaving the Rr axle on its tire, this works amazing and even allows for better turning with the old style braking system and seems to lessen the stress on the axles ,argos are very front heavy and this leads to the nessesity to keep the front end up the Rr is not a problem and we drive on the worst loon **** you've ever seen with this setup

[Swamper]

I use grade 5 bolts instead of grade 8. They are softer so as not to elongate the holes in the sprockets and axles. This setup has worked good for me so far. With screwing the sidewalls to the rim, don't tighten the screws tight. Leave a little space under the head and the rim. About a finger nail with. This will allow some movement so the heads of the screws won't break off. Had that happen before. I can't talk to much about tracks because I don't have any. I plow my long driveway with just my tires and no track. I load the rear with about 100 lbs of ballast to keep the rear down so that all 6 wheels are pretty much equally loaded.
Hope this helps you with some of your decisions.
Cheers,
Al

[MIteyMT]

Man this just keeps getting smarter all the time. Thank you

Robinhood02: You are running older argos, do you use a bearing cage of any kind with your 8x6x2 setup? Are you making your tracks or using argo plastics? Do you run tracks on anything with an OH160 Tecumseh? Are you using a bearing cage? Very good information, I was having the same idea but with two wheels in tracks, to minimize power demand, and on the front since it does seem to pivot about the driver seat quite a bit. Have you removed any chains?
Swamper, I was going to try going with one grade eight, and drill for a bronze or brass bushing, but 2 grade five is much easier, distributes load better, and has some of that bushing ability being lower carbon steel. Robinhood, you should consider bushing before it's too late! I am going to go a round on grade fives first.
On the sidewall drilling, I think that I can take my somewhat tired tires, put them on these factory max rims that seat the bead on both sides, screw the sidewalls with short self tapping screws that go about halfway into the tire, (not quite all the way tight, thanks), and if I were really feeling froggy, now I could safely tube those tires, and throw in about 8 or 10 ounces of slime, and maybe maybe finally stop dealing with a tire issue every hour of operation (5 psi). I also think these might be prepped good enough to go into my homemade halftrack or three quarter track.

Tubes?
Remove chains?
Experience with max factory wheel beads versus argo "no-beads", as I like to call them?
We'll get to the outboard later

[Robinhood02]

i run some old argos and some new ones , some old Maxs and some new ones, LOL well versed in these machines , the new argos are a dream to operate compared to the old ones but they are getting carried away with their prices , Motors- i got rid of all the noisy old unreliable Techumseh and installed Briggs or Kohlers ,Brg cages- yes i use Max brg cages on the Front and third axles (each end of tracks) without the cages i was bustin too many axles, Tracks- i use the 18' plastic ones on both Maxs and Argos (caution, the plastic tracks don't like big rocks, logs or ice ,NO traction) ,but i do have some with factory rubber, Chains- no i leave all chains in place, Grade 8 pins- i'll keep the grade 8 and fix them once in a while ,i rent these units out and less customer hastle the better (happy renters keep coming back), Tubes- tubes are a must up here and i never had a problem of poped beads ----I'm in the process of converting one of my Maxs over to a Oil Bath chain galley and keeping everything else factory so i can verify any difference, i suspect it is going to be dramatic, the Easter long weekend has put that behind schedule LOL

[MIteyMT]

Thank you. Very helpful. You say tubes are a must, I visualize less down time do to a heavily slimed tubed tire with a solid bead. Do you know what i am talking about when I say beadless or no-bead argo rim. My 83 seats the outer bead nicely, but the inner bead has no diameter difference on the rim to hold that bead, at 5 psi I am constantly losing tires. My local max dealer wants to sell me max wheels today that hold a bead on both sides, they are old factory max wheels. Why did argo do that, do you have wheels like this?
Bearing cages, so helpful, cage the first and third with max bearing cages. Did this require spacers. Seems like a good bit of space on my 83 argo. I better have a look. I will call my dealer, I am sure he has these in stock for maxes.
Ok, we are getting there, should I buy those max wheels, do you use axle spacers, and why do you run tubes? ( I want to run tubes, too, just want to make sure I am thinking right) Then I can go get my hands dirty

And you rent them, no wonder you were looking for 50 tires!!! Did you buy them for 80 a piece?

[MIteyMT]

What were they thinking!!?

Either I am missing something here, or Argo screwed up.

This picture tells quite a story. Notice the copious amounts of expensive name brand tire sealing compound. Notice the tire...not seated. Notice the shape of the metal rim. (how can that hold a tire on?) Did I really spend all that time last year handbusting tires because Argo has a faulty rim design. The other side of the rim seats a bead nicely. I would take a picture, but the tire is still connected on that side. I have lots of these, like about 5.
Will factory max wheels solve this. Unless I am just wrong, then Argo designed and sold a rim (granted, back in the day) that cannot hold a tire bead on in a rut at 5 psi...period.
I am posting about this a lot, that is because I can't fathom that my problem is this simple, and because if I am gonna buy these max rims (which I am told are different) then I am supposed to do it tonight. So many thanks for all the advice. I can only repay you with cell phone pictures and enthusiasm

[jpswift1]

That certainly is a poorly designed rim and the only application that it should be used for is on a garden tractor or golf cart. If you get a set of Max K-Lock bead lock wheels (these are standard equipment on Maxes for the past 10 years or so) you will have no problem holding a bead on even at 1 PSI. I NEVER lost a bead on any of my Max K lock wheels and I run them on every different machine that I own. I heard there are even guys that run tires at 0 PSI without any issues. Call up Recreatives and order up some and you'll be happy that you did. Plus they have a nice deep glossy black powdercoated finish on them. www.maxatvs.com

[MIteyMT]

I will give him a call. 8"?

Here is a picture of the kind of tread left on my tires, I should be getting better performance. Maybe with the right rims I will!

[jpswift1]

Any of the good folks at Recreatives will be able to help you out. You'll want the 8" rims, that's correct. They'll be a world of difference!

[Robinhood02]

yup the K locs will fix your problem but i still run tubes LOL they are easyer to fix a flat on the trail than patching a tire itself ,(its easyer to pull the tube out than get the tire off the rim)

[Roger S]

Those old wheels of yours may not be argo wheels.. I don't know about that old of a model. Could be aftermarket golf cart, etc wheels. The argo wheels I've seen had beads on both sides. They're still not as good as max k lock wheels by any means. I have seen a few tires lose a bead off of 8" k locks, 22" rawhide III's and 22" super swampers. But they were used tires that had been mounted/ de mounted/lost a bead, etc a few times so the bead dia. was probably stretched. I think they would be good glue candidates.

Max and argo both made "regular" wheels with beads on both sides, then around 1998 Max used the improved K lock. So the old max wheels your friend has might not be k locks. But any wheel with beads will be better.

[MIteyMT]

I just got back from the hardware store, where I got a 5/16 x 2 1/2" bolt to drop into my 83 argo shear pin hole. I noticed afterwards that the hole closest to the sprocket is a tight fit, and you cannot get a bolt on there at all. Is this where you all have been grinding the head flat to squeeze that bolt in there, or have you been only putting a bolt in one of the holes? I thought maybe I should drop a roll pin in that one and a bolt in the other, or maybe use ready bolt sections with nuts on both sides?

[Robinhood02]

you will have to put good roll pin in those ones that dont have room ,even if you grind the head flat on one side it will then go in but you wont be able to put the nut on and tighten it up ,but make sure you use a real roll pin not the cheap spring pin