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I'm trying to find out what grade or grades of steel are the best for making new axles. I have to have some larger diameter axles made. Thanks in advance..
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Last edited by doccerny; 01-17-2011, 01:26 AM. -
I believe it's 4140 chrome moly alloy.....but I really dont understand the numbers, I just trust my machinist! The theory is hard steel is brittle and wont take the shock loads,, mild steel bends too easy, and spring steel (chro-moly) will flex with the stress and return to original shape. Like a tree bends in the wind. OK bad example
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Shoot a pm/email to a member by the name of "Whipper" out in Arizona. I believe he knows a great deal about steel and axles.Comment
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A long time I have been a fan of using 4140 heat treated steel for my axles which as it comes of the shelf it has a yield strength of 90,000 psi in the heat treated state. But in the future I will be using 1144 Lasalle stress proof steel as it comes in an annealed state at 100,000 psi yield strength and it is easier to machine. Comperable in price, perhaps cheaper but that may depend on where you obtain it from. Yield strenght is what you should shoot for.Comment
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I'm like you, I got to trust someone when they go to spitting out numbers. Too bad they aren't in grades like bolts. LOLComment
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A cursory look online shows that you can get 1144 Lasalle stress proof for around $10 to $15 a foot. That's just a per foot basis for 1.250" round; not splined or anything fancy. You may be able to get it cheaper locally.
Whipper supplied me with a 1" OD axle a few years back that he wanted me to try out. I forget what the material was, but maybe he'll chime in with some information.
~msigpicComment
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Most if not all medium alloy steels can be heat treated to a myriad of tensile and yield strengths. Cost is the limiting factor for most of us because you would have to have a heat treat house do this but of course it"s not cheap. Check with your local supplier if you have one. Or online suppliers like Speedy Metals have quite a selection to choose from.Comment
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Thank all of you,I'll ponder it around with my buddy the machinest.Comment
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Ah, then I want to amend my advice from above. You should have your machinist buddy pm/email/(maybe call) Whipper. They would probably speak the same language anyway. In this case Whipper is more than a machinist; he is also an aficionado of these machines and has experience with what does and does not work.Comment
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Yip, I've seen and read alot about Whipper on here he is the guru. I snapped another back axle the other day and it was new ( month old). My Argo doesnt even look like an Argo anymore. We use it as a flat bed mule and the axles can't handle the weight (3000Lbs vehicle and cargo) we don't abuse it , just slow and easy, but its too borderline on over weight. The first 2 years we didn't have trouble but have broke 3 axles this winter. One of the new ones just broke Saturday, so it wasn't because they were 40 years old like we guessed.Originally posted by JohnF View Post
Probably gunna rebuild the frame and everything(big axles and bearings) again this summer but I got to get it going to last me into Feb.Comment
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Thanks Whipper, I,m replacing the 1" dia. original shafts, one at a time. Until Sat. and A one month old new shaft broke. Don't know where it broke yet haven't tore it apart. My buddy is a machinist, and told me I shouldn't break this one but we did. I'll ask him in a min. what we made the replacement shafts out of. I got to get one made now, but it only has to work for abou 3 weeks, then this summer we can break her down again and beef up everything. So you would suggest the 4140 heat treated and not spline it. The axles are breaking between the inner and outer bearings, at the sprocket pin holes.Any suggestions? Thanks alot. MikeOriginally posted by whipper-ag View PostYou never said what kind of axles. Solid or splined? Or how big a diameter?
1144 is a cold drawn bar & might do crazy things after you machine it. I don't know if it's available in turn, ground & polished. If it isn't you might have to buy oversized material & grind it down. That can get expensive if you have to do that. It's probably a better material than 4140, but if it's a splined axle, by the time you cut the spline, it could warp all over the place one time & be fine the next. If an axle doesn't run true & straight, it's not worth putting in a car.
I've had good luck with the 4140 pre-heat treated material, turned, ground & polished. The TGP tolerance is +.000 -.001 - .0015. That's just enough clearance to slip in the bearing.
Anyone that is doing the gear work, tell them not to spline them unless they run true between centers, otherwise it might not fit in the internal spline of the sprocket. There is only about .002 clearance between the minor & major dia. of a 6 tooth straight sided spline. So hobbing an axle with too much runout will cause it not to fit.
Hope this helps somewhat.
Whipper
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Well talked to my machinest buddy and he made them out of 4140 heat treated,so I guess their just too small dia.and I'll have to beaf them up to 1 3/8" or 1 1/2"this summer. Whipper would you spline the bigger shaft diameter for the sprockets or not? My buddy is a machinist for a oil drilling company he knew every word you suggested and translated it to me. LOLComment
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Hey guys thought i might chime in with my 2 cents on this topic as i am a machinist and just recently finished making all new axles for my argo as well. First off, 4140 is a great choice. It machines fairly easy and is very tough and stable when machining. A cheaper alternative however with somewhat similar properties, which i made my axles out of, is 1045 steel. Its a hot rolled steel, still very stable and almost as tough as 4140. Its also readily available in precision ground shafts at less than $10 / ft. I used 1 1/4" for mine and also made them longer to extend the wheels and they are really strong, and i drive mine like whipper...like a rental. lol.Comment
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