Older Max IV with Adair Synthetic Bearings

[onlyonce]

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I think this synthetic bearing has enough going for it to give it a try and see how it holds up. I have been nothing but disappointed with how long the factory supplied bearings and stamped flanges hold up with abuse even with greasing after every ride.

I have the older style Max that uses the smaller bearings so I was able to use the argo bearing retainers with the two seals but left out the usual bearing. When using the argo retainers be sure to flatten the flat matting surface then you can use a very thin gasket rather than the thick cork one usually supplied.

I always weld up my support bolts to some old stamped retainers so any tightening can take place on the outside of the machine the extra metal also reduces frame pucker at bolt heads. On a Max IV you just can't reach some of the necessary inside bolts if they need to be tightened and the machine is back together.

As received the synthethic bearings had the holes drilled all the way through(I believe they now come with some drilled part way through) and as you can see I plugged the one that I was using for the grease channel. I also had to make a home built reamer to enlarge and smooth the hole for the axle as it was way too tight a fit on the axles and rough. If anyone wants to know what the reamer looks like let me know.

I drilled two small angled holes for the grease to be directed towards the center of the bearing. Would love to figure out a way to use a seal for the inboard side of bearing.

Make sure your axles are very straight before trying this because when an axle bends it is usually right at the bearing. With this set up that point or bend is now inside the synthetic bearing so that would wear out a big hole fast.

Sorry to be so long winded. The drawing should explain alot.
Let the abuse begin.

[thebuggyman1]

Wow, I'm glad you posted this. It should help a lot of others who were asking questions about the Thread I had on bearing extensions yesterday.

http://www.6x6world.com/forums/general-6x6-atv-discussion/25527-bearing-extensions.html

Go put some miles on them and let us know how you like them.
For the inner grease seal, a standard seal could be installed. It would just need to be recessed in and I'd make sure it stayed in place with a pair of wood (coarse thread) screws.IMG_0013.jpg

Seals: skf # 12456 or 12458 have a 2" O.D. and 1.25" I.D.

[jpswift1]

Thanks for explaining this for everyone. I have to commend you for your idea on drilling the holes for the grease to flow. I'm surprised they didn't come that way, because I'd think that will help extend the life of these. I'm going to be interested to see how they work and how many hours they'll last. It seems to me that these are just plastic bushings, so I don't see how they could be labeled "synthetic bearings". In my opinion, I don't think they'll hold up all that well because there's too much force and too much friction, unless you're doing mostly slow speed trail riding in a machine that doesn't have a lot of weight in it. Also, when they wear out and you go to replace them, I wonder if they'd wear some of the axle material down. If that's the case, the new ones will allow your axles have a little play to them since the diameter of your axle is smaller from the wear. This will then wear your seals out prematurely and let in water and mud and grit, making them wear out even faster. Let us know what you find out.

[JoeMeg]

Hats off to both of you. This is what a hobby is about. Onlyonce,I'd like to see the reamer please.

Joe.

[jpswift1]

Jim, I think your idea with the bearings at the end up them will work great. I'd like to see you guys compare notes after some hours of usage on your machines. Keep us updated!

[Bazooo guy]

I have used the same material as a bushing in industrial applications where water is present.
The water lubricates the plastic and helps but if any dirt or grit gets in they wear real fast.
The plastic is tough and i have never seen it crack from impact but if it gets hot it will melt like butter.
Make sure the shaft has some clearance or it will get hot and melt to the shaft.
When used as a bushing to support weight the hole wears and it can be flipped for extended life
but on an axle it will be sloppy and thats not good.
I like the idea of using it as a bearing extension to move the bearing away from the tub but dont think
they will work as a bearing replacement.

[thebuggyman1]

I too have seen it used in industrial machines, typically used as guides and slides. These machines go through thousands of cycles a day with no problems......BUT it's just not the same as an amphib bearing. My best guess is similar to yours...they will work well until contaminates get in, then it will be the same as with a steel bearing. On the upside, they may just support the axle better, have less flex, and be less prone to have the dirt and grit bypass the seal. Only time will tell.

[kghills]

Thanks for explaining this for everyone. I have to commend you for your idea on drilling the holes for the grease to flow. I'm surprised they didn't come that way, because I'd think that will help extend the life of these. I'm going to be interested to see how they work and how many hours they'll last. It seems to me that these are just plastic bushings, so I don't see how they could be labeled "synthetic bearings". In my opinion, I don't think they'll hold up all that well because there's too much force and too much friction, unless you're doing mostly slow speed trail riding in a machine that doesn't have a lot of weight in it. Also, when they wear out and you go to replace them, I wonder if they'd wear some of the axle material down. If that's the case, the new ones will allow your axles have a little play to them since the diameter of your axle is smaller from the wear. This will then wear your seals out prematurely and let in water and mud and grit, making them wear out even faster. Let us know what you find out.

I had over 50 hours on the ones in my Bigfoot before I sold it. They were perfectly tight and did not leak a drop of water. As far as I know they are still holding up perfectly for the new owner but do not know how many more hours are on the machine now. It is supposed to come back to me for maintenance when it had another 100 hours on it. I fit mine tight, light press fit, just lubed it up really well and left the inner bore a little rough to hold grease. The whole assembly is very tight even with no inner seal. Mine were drilled to be greased. I greased them at 50 hours and had to be very careful not to blow the cork seals out when trying to grease them. Learned to snug all the bolts as the cork compresses a bit after some use. Yes even with no inner seal if I tried to pump the grease in too fast the it would try to push out the cork gasket. The amazing thing about this set up is how water tight it made my Bigfoot. I could float it for hours and never leak a drop of water in the tub.



Here is a video of it in action.

Keith.

[onlyonce]

The material to make the reamer does not get any easier to find then this. It is the same thing I use when I need a specific dia. piece of material to press in bearings or seals by contacting the outer race only. When needed I make the journey out to the garden shed and find the last tapered wooden shovel handle I broke. I then find the dia. needed some where along its length and cut off 90 degrees.
If using for pressing bearings and seals I slightly relieve the center of the end grain so it only contacts outer race and then cut to the length needed. The reamer is same handle cut to where it just starts fitting in the synthetic bearing. Then I cut a slot into which a piece power hacksaw blade with teeth ground off is slid in and held secure with two screws.Cut a slight relief on the one side of blade to allow room for shavings. Grease up and turn, after a couple of complete revolutions remove, clean shavings and repeat. Work from both sides of bearing. I mounted mine in a variable speed lathe to speed up the process. It will true them up quickly with no chatter
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[akranger72]

onlyonce please let us know how these bearings are working? I'm thinking of putting these on my 750 HDi 4 center axles. Thanks

[Noel Woods]

I've got two on my Argo Frontier on the middle axles. I've put about 20 hours on the machine post conversion. They are holding up well and no water has gotten in the interior.
Whether they are bushings or bearings its hard to say, I've put my machine through some paces and I'm impressed so far. The Argo will be at the Mud Nationals if anyone wants to check them out. In terms of wearing into the axle, any bearing can do that-the factory bearings nearly cut through one axle so I had to replace it. I utilize the grease passage on mine, but I do think on a slow / low speed machine that the material is self lubricating to some extent and maybe not necessary to grease these bearings. Time will tell.
The older Max 4 conversion is a perfect utilization for these, thinking about them for my Max4 when they are due replacement. I think they would also work well for a Hustler.

[mudbug3]

The forum member BW6 made some synthetic bearings like this and spun them non stop on a short axle for over 1,000 hours and then removed the synthetic bearings to check for wear. BW6 told me that even after 1,000 hours of continual use, the synthetic bearings showed very minimal wear. Hardly any forum member will put 1,000 hours on his machine.

[brushcutter]

That is an AWESOME reamer!!! Definitely one I'll keep in mind.

[ARGOJIM]

Good thing you said hardly, 1018 and counting.

[onlyonce]

This max IV with synethic bearings will be at Busco in April if anyone wants to check them out.