Best Swimming Setup For Buffalo???

[leoniru]

I finally got a chance to put the Buff in the water. As this was my very first water outing in ANY type of AATV, I may have had unrealistic expectations, though in the videos I've watched, Max's seem to do OK. Perhaps the Buff is an exception because it did anything but instill confidence in me. It has the 21x11x8 Goodyear Rawhides on with the 'V' facing rearwards (on the top of the tire), and about 1/2" tread height. I struggled to get it out of the pond. This after s-l-o-w-l-y making our way from one end to the other...a distance of perhaps 60 yards. Maybe it's the wheel/tire combo, but I've seen bobbers moving a whole lot faster while dead drifted, and the whole time it was in floatable depth water it listed (excessively, I thought) first to one side and then the other as I nervously made slight corrections in my weight placement by leaning to one side or the other. I know it wouldn't have taken much to swamp it. I was sure we were going down to see Davey Jones, and then when I finally got to the far bank - which was a very slight slope... it couldn't pull our arses out!! Just sat there and spun the wheels. FWIW, this little pond on my property has a weedy, muddy shoreline, but I still expected it to do better than it did. I swear I could hear the bass laughing. I finally made for another stretch of shoreline and after much spinning and pleading with the gods, it finally got some traction and got out.
Am I missing something here, or is this the best I can expect???
The wife is already in her I-told-you-so mode.

Signed,
Maybe I should have bought an Argo or Mudd Ox

[msafi65]

The 26x12x12 terra grips are the best Ive tried on a buf truck.The V has to point forward on the ground to swim. I agree with you the truck isnt the best swimmer with the box and low rear vents. Be carefull coming up out of deep water. The truck is more stable at about half throttle, I think the tires act as gryos?? Buf truck is at its best in the brush and mud. Lower gearing from the IV and added weight make push thrugh things that the lighter machines get stoped on. My opinion is that the truck is the best dollar value amphib on the market. Keep driving and have fun

[leoniru]

Me thinks that a LOT of the listing tendency is caused by 1.) a lack of buoyancy which would be helped by the larger 26x12x12 wheel/tire combo and maybe some added buoyancy contraption along each side (sealed 4"-6" diameter x 6' long PVC tubing?); and 2.) the heavy dump bed which is positioned quite high on the vehicle. In any event, it seems to me to be quite a stretch to call this vehicle 'amphibious'. Seems to swim like a legless elephant!

I'm looking for a set of 12" rims with 26" tires, but wonder if the Carlisle tires for Argos would be a better bet?

[Bud]

The 24" Argo Frontier tires and the 25" Avenger tires swim very well.

[Bud]

Oh, and sometimes it is better to back out of a pond bank. Mud traction is better when the chevrons bite down into the mud, versus swim speed with the chevrons pointing up.

[leoniru]

Bud,
Are the 24" Frontier and 25" Avenger tires made by Carlisle??
How wide are they and what diameter wheel do they require??

[Noel Woods]

I have it on pretty good authority that Interco will have the ASX tires back in circulation in 2012. These come in 26x13x12 and are truly wicked tires on any machine that has a large enough wheel well to support their size. They should fit the Buff, so you may want to put up with the lackluster 21" until the other tires are back on the market.

[leoniru]

These are the asymetrical tires, right? A quick search showed some places still have some in stock, but one place wanted about twice as much for a right side tire as a left?!?!?!?!? Huh?

Who would make a rim for the Buff that would work with these tires?

Anyway to calculate (relatively easy, please) the buoyancy of various size tire/wheel combos?

[cclingma]

I pursued a set of ASX pretty hard here a month or so ago. All the online places that I found that showed to have the 26x13x12 in stock would end up not having them when I called or emailed. Some places would have the narrow version. I called Interco as well and as mentioned above, they said they will be available again.

[Bud]

Bud,
Are the 24" Frontier and 25" Avenger tires made by Carlisle??
How wide are they and what diameter wheel do they require??

Carlisle makes the tires on my Frontier. They are 24x10-8.

[greg pinson]

I have a 2001, I think, Max Buffalo with the 26 inch Goodyears, and it swims like a fish. It is the only AATV I have ever been around, but with me, wife and both kids, it will swim faster than a person wearing fins. Very good directional control also.

[Stonewall]

Who would make a rim for the Buff that would work with these tires?

Anyway to calculate (relatively easy, please) the buoyancy of various size tire/wheel combos?

You can get the 12" wheels directly from Recreatives Industries, who make the Buffalo Truck.

When calculating buoyancy, the weight of the water you displace is equal to the amount of buoyancy that you gain.(with said displacement vessel completely submerged). So, for tires you can estimate by calculating the approximate volume of the tire mounted to the rim, then subtracting the weight of the tire/wheel combo from the buoyancy of your calculated cylinder.

Water weighs ~62.5 lbs per cubic foot.

The volume of a cylinder is Pi x Radius squared x Height.
In the case of a tire, your radius is half of the diameter, and the height is the tire's width.

Again I stress this is an ESTIMATE.

For a 26-12x12 tire:

Tire: 3.142*13^2*12 ~ 6400 cubic inches

The wheel is dead space, so it has to be calculated and subtracted from the total volume.

Wheel: 3.142*6^2*12 ~ 1400 cubic inches

6400-1400=5000 ci

There are 1728 cubic inches in 1 cubic foot.

5000/1728 ~ 3 cubic feet

Tire buoyancy ~ 62.5 x 3 = 187.5 LBs, and to correct for weight, this setup weighs approximately 35 lbs, so that's about 150 lbs of flotation when COMPLETELY SUBMERGED.

[leoniru]

I follow you Stonewall. So six of these 26x12x12 would generate about 900 lbs. of flotation when fully submerged.
Assuming a tire/wheel weight of 28 lbs. (I'm purely guessing here) for the 21x11x8 I have on now, I come up with a value of approximately 492 lbs. of flotation for six of 'em. Seems like a pretty significant difference......nearly double!.
I needs me some bigger tires/wheels and save these 21x11x8 for running a set of Adair tracks if Adair can provide a set to work with 'em.
My Buffalo came with either wheel extensions or the outboard bearing setup. I'm not sure as I have yet to pull a wheel off and look. Ether way I'm hoping that I could run a set of the 26" Vampires when they return on the market.

[leoniru]

Noel, FWIW I just spoke with a fellow in the ATV tire industry regarding the Interco Vampires. None available yet, however, I did get some info out of him. He said there was a chapter 11 process which resulted in the tire molds for these being sent out of the US (original country of manufacture). First move was to Mexico, then somewhere in Asia, and now they are reportedly being made in Taiwan. He said they are having QC issues at present. It doesn't sound like I want to hold my breath on these becoming available.

[Noel Woods]

Yes, that's exactly what I have been told. I heard that the facility that ended up with the molds (Thailand, then Taiwan) have had issues with Q.C. but are getting those sorted out and production is coming back up, with the first tires going to Asia, then later this year to America.