Mudd-Ox satisfaction

[mightymaxIV]

Having observed many different machines with many different set ups, here is what I have to say: A Mudd Ox with Adair tracks is the absolute ultimate as a recovery vehicle, you can pull 4x4's and side by sides out of extreme mud conditions all day and never strain the machine, one tug with my Frontier and the belt was squealing.

The Mudd Ox wasn't the best swimmer but equipped with Adair tracks I never saw a mud hole that it wouldn't go through and the Hydraulics were a great advantage in most situations. Every machine has some good and bad points. So the Ox burns a little more fuel. The Machine is a beast and the weapon of choice for many situations.

[brushcutter]

Having observed many different machines with many different set ups, here is what I have to say: A Mudd Ox with Adair tracks is the absolute ultimate as a recovery vehicle, you can pull 4x4's and side by sides out of extreme mud conditions all day and never strain the machine, one tug with my Frontier and the belt was squealing.

The Mudd Ox wasn't the best swimmer but equipped with Adair tracks I never saw a mud hole that it wouldn't go through and the Hydraulics were a great advantage in most situations. Every machine has some good and bad points. So the Ox burns a little more fuel. The Machine is a beast and the weapon of choice for many situations.

That's what I would think Dan, and in a lighter 6X6 version, with a set of Adair tracks, one could trade a little water speed for the only need a winch to retrieve all the stuck machines absolute mudding ability. I mean lets face it, although water speed is important, I've yet to see any aatv pulling water skiers... but I have seen some(myself included) stuck really bad!

[stid2677]

Diesel Mudd-Ox in the water unloaded

Diesel Mudd-Ox loaded

The video showing MY ox swimming was NOT loaded and the only thing in it was me. That was the first and last time I ever tried to swim it. I would NOT recommend swimming one setup like mine with the diesel, top and cab.

I have had issues with mine and it still runs hot. The dealer and Mr Matt have been very helpful in solving all issues except the over heating. Very capable machine, one thing that still concerns me is the fact that it takes an OX or similar vehicle to recover one. I too live in Alaska and if it breaks down 50 miles from a road, there is no way it can be towed out without a lot of effort. Once dead it has no steering or brakes with the chains off and the chains need to be removed to get it to roll. I have made a towbar for mine that mounts onto the plow mounts so it can be towed by another rig.

IMHO they need a way to get the system to freewheel without chain removal or hyd bypass. Because often they are in water and trying to get to the chains or bypass is all most impossible.

Mine is no longer in warranty so I have to try to figure out a way to fix my overheating issue, removing the engine cowling helps, but when traveling long distances it still gets hot and I have to stop and let it idle for a while to drop the temp.

The other issue is the design of the chain tighteners, the front ones work great, the others not so much.

Living 400 miles from the Alaskan dealer has made me into an Ox mechanic and I have learned to fix most issues with it and for the most part the other issues were minor electrical problems, they still left the machine DOA, but I was able to contact the Alaskan dealer and through them and Mr Matt was able to recover the machine.

I knew mine was one of the first to have the diesel engine and I expected a few bugs and really have no problem with getting them worked out, but I am disappointed that mine has from new ran hot and still does to this date.

[mudbug3]

The video showing MY ox swimming was NOT loaded and the only thing in it was me. That was the first and last time I ever tried to swim it. I would NOT recommend swimming one setup like mine with the diesel, top and cab.

I have had issues with mine and it still runs hot. The dealer and Mr Matt have been very helpful in solving all issues except the over heating. Very capable machine, one thing that still concerns me is the fact that it takes an OX or similar vehicle to recover one. I too live in Alaska and if it breaks down 50 miles from a road, there is no way it can be towed out without a lot of effort. Once dead it has no steering or brakes with the chains off and the chains need to be removed to get it to roll. I have made a towbar for mine that mounts onto the plow mounts so it can be towed by another rig.

IMHO they need a way to get the system to freewheel without chain removal or hyd bypass. Because often they are in water and trying to get to the chains or bypass is all most impossible.

Mine is no longer in warranty so I have to try to figure out a way to fix my overheating issue, removing the engine cowling helps, but when traveling long distances it still gets hot and I have to stop and let it idle for a while to drop the temp.

The other issue is the design of the chain tighteners, the front ones work great, the others not so much.

Living 400 miles from the Alaskan dealer has made me into an Ox mechanic and I have learned to fix most issues with it and for the most part the other issues were minor electrical problems, they still left the machine DOA, but I was able to contact the Alaskan dealer and through them and Mr Matt was able to recover the machine.

I knew mine was one of the first to have the diesel engine and I expected a few bugs and really have no problem with getting them worked out, but I am disappointed that mine has from new ran hot and still does to this date.

Great post stid2677!

A friend of Mine recommended having a pulling fan on one side of the Mudd-Ox engine cover and a pushing fan on the opposite side. The engineer said a fan set up like this would help a lot more with your heat issues. The new style chain adjusters on the Mudd-Ox are a great improvement over the chain adjusters that I had on my 2010 Mudd-Ox. I called the Mudd-Ox dealer in Alaska and he told me that to get the ' 'proper adjustment ' on the chains of a Mudd-Ox was to jack the wheels off of the ground, , remove the tracks ( if you had them installed ), and then move the wheel closest to the chain tensioner that needs adjustment side to side ,and this would allow the chains to move so you could make proper chain adjustment. He told me that trying to adjust the chains with all of the tires on the ground would'nt give you proper chain tension on a Mudd-Ox with tracks. I will take a Mudd-Ox dealers word for this! This was a real pain having to remove my Adair tracks each time that I needed to make chain adjustments on my Mudd-Ox. I still own a 2002 Max IV 6x6 with tires,and I had to adjust the chains on my Mudd-OX with Adair tracks on it just as often as I had to adjust the chains on my Max IV with tires on it ,or I could hear the chains clicking against the frame of the Mudd-Ox as I drove it.

My friends and I often drive into long narrow creeks with 40 degree banks on either side, and depending on where we are in a creek, it could be Extremely hard to get a machine towed out, facing forward or backwards. We also drive our machine into the large swamps at the atv park we like to ride at. The only machine that could tow a Mudd-Ox out that broke down in one of the swamps where we often ride , would be another running Mudd-Ox. No 4x4, truck, tractor,or back hoe could follow us in the soft swamp, and no amphib besides a Mudd-Ox could drag a non running Mudd-Ox left and right out of swamp or through tight wooded trails. Every thing that is mechancial can and will break down some times, that's a fact! Since I sold my Mudd-Ox I have read post online about a Mudd-Ox leaving the owner stranded or broke down some where because a hydrolic hose coupling failed, or a plastic part in the clutch failed. Granted, these were not because of Matt's build quality, but mechanical failures from different parts suppliers that Matt uses. I had these same problems when I worked at a GM assembly plant with their part suppliers. Matt is doing the best that he can to build a quality product ( I believe that ), but mechancial parts do fail. Depending on the weather that you find yourself in, how far you are from home or camp, what time of day it is, what trail situation that you find your Mudd-Ox broke down in, becomes a factor when considering a Mudd-Ox that weighs over 2,000 pds with a driver, not easy to work on ( compared to a Max or Argo ) and can't be easily be towed out by any amphib ( depending on where it breaks down at ), but another Mudd-Ox. Even with the chains disconnected on a Mudd-Ox, just imagine trying to drag a machine this heavy with a machine that uses clutch belts, and then have to drag it left or right to make turns because you can't steer it! The Mudd-Ox is a Great machine, but not the machine for me or for most receational users.

[kghills]

The Mudd-Ox is a Great machine, but not the machine for me.

I think because although it is not a super large machine it is aimed at the commercial market. Sound like it can haul a lot of equipment.

I have actually pulled a stuck Mudd-Ox out of deep mud up a small hill with my Max IV. Took me a couple trys to get it to start moving though. Brandon probably has it on video he's just too polite to post it.

Keith.

[Buzz]

In hopes of helping someone- some random thoughts and maintenance info.

I've always been leary of those huge aluminum cabs in the water. I think that's probably the biggest think working against you. It's more of a super-unbalanced load as opposed to anything else. It's not your fault you didn't know I suppose. My 2012 diesel is much more stable than that in the water, and that's with escargos on it....not to say I wouldn't like a bit more floatation in the front. It is a canvas top and has a bit lighter frame for what it's worth. I'm guessing between wheel spacers and tracks it's probably an additional 400 lbs or more. Each track is 186 lb on 4 inch spacing (5 inch spacing is lighter and more agressive). I "may" replace "some" of the crossers with poly crossers from beaverdam following some testing. In as far as "what-ifs" go - no doubt you could tow one even if only short distances at a time if need be. Sometime you have to do that if your machine (any machine really) is overloaded. Guys have towed very heavy things with argos even though they're not "rated" to do so... with proper technique. But-there isn't really a good way tow an argo or mudd-ox that has no steering. I'd probably use some sort of a skid, sled or trailer, but a better solutions always seems to fix it in place and drive it out. It may even be easier to winch it -most guys have at least a several thousand pound winch and carry a snatch block - and move it to a more convenient place to make repairs. I have heard about the "coupler" failure on a direct drive machine but never a cause. All I can guess is that it was a problem with the part itself, or "shock-loading" of the drivetrain (poor driving technique). I can envision having your rpms up high, dropping into a large hole and immediately up the face of that hole with momentum. You're going to shock-load the drivetrain (if your sticks are too far forward) and probably shouldn't be driving with such high power in that situation. A clutch-driven machine doesn't have this problem and is why the driver (especially new driver) has a "safety-fuse" of sorts in the belt. Harder to stall, harder to do damage I would think. An example where this could happen is driving through very large tussocks too fast and with much more power than necessary.
In regards to tightening chains, it seems to me that all 6/8 wheelers benefit from having tracks removed and tires off the ground. It doesn't seem right to do it with the rolling weight of the vehicle "on" the tires and/or tracks.
Overheating: my engine temps will climb if I have a prolonged ground speed with the sticks full or mostly full forward. I'm guessing the flow through the system during this situation puts more strain on the engine like a taller gear would. Less so if I slow down. If I'm working the sticks I have zero problems. Usually it's rare for me to be cruising down long, straight roads at higher speed with my 8x8. I can only guess that this would be similar to overpropping a boat engine. The machines have plenty of power to do so, but I've always wondered what the exhaust temps (no guage) are when driving them like this. They're definitely made to crawl, climb, tow, and maneuver I think. Sometimes I'll crank the heater and open the canvas to sponge more heat off the engine. I think the newer machines have a more severe-duty cooling system as compared to yours. I can see how overheating would be frustrating. It seems like stopping to idle for a few minutes is a pretty quick fix.
On another note, as far as primary/secondary clutch removal (maintenance) goes: on my 2010 gas machine
Secondary: loosen front chain so that it droops, thread bolt (I forget size-but there is a threaded hole) into outer sheave to separate and allow belt to drop into secondary.
This slack allows you to easily derail the belt (by the drooping front chain). Secondary clutch can then be removed without changing its orientation- should come out from under the bench seat near the parking brake lever (parking brake cable has to be removed, easily as well for clearance). Primary: exhaust manifold has to come off -4-bolts, as well as back half of air filter cover. Exhaust manifold can easily be maneuvered out. 4 bolts on engine mounting plate 9/16 I believe, easy to access with exhaust manifold out...wiggle engine towards the passenger side a few inches (no need to disconnect anything else- well maybe 1 hose clamp and slide bilge pump hose off if it's in the way). This gives enough clearance to the left side of the tub to slide the primary off the shaft. You can also get to the starter very easily with the exhaust manifold and primary clutch out of the way. None of this is complicated. Just wedging a large screw driver behind the rear sheaves is enough to hold them while the nuts on the outer sheaves are removed.

I wished I had extra hydraulic fluid one time (brand new hose on left drive motor was leaking under driving load but not at idle under examination). When you drive, you have the seat on, so it's not like you would notice it. The newer machines must now come with "sight-level". My 2012 has one, and it'll catch your eye at the first sign of a low resevoir...if you see it. I wish there was an "alarm" on the hydraulic resevoir for a low condition. It wouldn't surprise me if they currently do.
Anyhow, I just got the 2nd set of tracks in and got some maintenance done, so it shouldn't be too long before I get some videos (gas machine)......not that we have any snow yet....Dec 5th!!

[Buzz]

for what it's worth, it is nice to be able to sit on a rear bench seat, use the other's as "counter space" and make repairs (if need be) all while under the cover of a canvas. There comes a time everyone has to do it, and it always seems like it's raining or buggy

[izza753]

Sound's like your having the same problem I'm having!! I have been looking for a used mudd-ox for better than 6 months?? I'm sure that everyone has their own taste in machines but I'm starting to believe that the fact that you can't find a used one for sale speaks for itself!! Still looking

[tracmaster]

Two reasons i bought an argo hdi instead of the mud ox... nunber 1 .. one handed steering and number 2 the total height on the argo was much lower than the ox...my buddy has a mud ox and we are constantly cutting overhanging tree limbs to let him through...always carry a chain saw... if i only used it in open land then i very well may have bought the mud ox.

[Buzz]

Two reasons i bought an argo hdi instead of the mud ox... nunber 1 .. one handed steering and number 2 the total height on the argo was much lower than the ox...my buddy has a mud ox and we are constantly cutting overhanging tree limbs to let him through...always carry a chain saw... if i only used it in open land then i very well may have bought the mud ox.

well after owning multiple argos (conquest and avenger sized) and driving countless others....The mudd-ox is much more enjoyable to ride and far more maneuverable (and faster) in tight spots. Sometime in the argo (I love argos too) you have to shift so many times it becomes very bugging.
I steer one-handed all the time with my Ox (when turning aggressively or just loafing along... as the sticks are close together so you can operate them almost like a joystick)...using your fingers...and unlike the animals.....your opposing thumb You can even just place one of them forward (not all the way) and leave it....then just use the other to under-drive or over-drive the other stick. This will give you left/right turns moving only one stick....if you're going down a dirt road.

In really crappy terrain with a lot of navigating...it's especially handy to just set the throttle and then move both sticks around with one hand (fingers and thumb) if you have to lean aggressively (to see) when navigating the machine. You're never worried needing to operate the twist-grip throttle, steering, or even the parking brake....simultaneously. The parking brake is on the opposite side...so it become a game of feathering the throttle, sometimes engaging the belt....sometimes steering, sometimes not....other times using the parking brake to ease down a hill w/o turning if the clutches are disengaged or you need to do it slowly. It's very easy, but can get busy in the argo. When the going gets rough....and you need to be active driving your machine...the argo takes far more "hands" to drive. The mudd-ox has cup holders too if you're worried about that.

As far as clearance goes...they aren't much taller than an argo.....if you have the top off. You can also drive around with a full roll-over protection in place and seat belts....and then fold down your roll bar if you need to make your machine lower-profile. You also have a lot more ground-clearance on the underside of the machine.
They're just great machines that are more capable in the bush and just more fun to drive. I always thought the counter-rotation wouldn't be needed much, but it's proven to be invaluable....when every inch counts trying to navigate through and around obstacles.

The first couple years of gasser-machines (air cooled) worked best with the muffler re-located out of the engine box, low-gears, and clutching mods......and a proper understanding of how to let the hydraulics do the work.

The newer machines with the kubota turbo diesel are phenomenal, stronger yet... and better in every way while sipping fuel. Pretty much anyone can jump in one and make it perform......and there is no lack of performance. Hope that helps