Custom build questions

[chris davison]

If I was going to build another one I would go with trailing arm suspention and a hyd motor at each wheel
out side the body.
and go six wheels and be able to rotate the suspention up so the tires came out of the water for more water speed no drive shafts axles or chains as the suspention depresses only hyd. hoses move.A 70 hp diesel would do it but I would want 36 in tall tires for ground clearence.

[Middlefork Miner]

Noel, I'm in Ca. not Alaska...(I wish)...grin...but we have some really steep & rugged mountains here as well. Thanks for the heads up on the Winsun diesel...that looks to be a really attractive option. I'm not sure if it has the power needed for a hydraulic drive, but it would certainly be a REALLY nice, compact, VERY fuel efficient & self contained unit. I'm gonna try & get some weight calculations done this weekend & then run the numbers by my hydraulics guy & see what he thinks...The hydraulic drive would certainly be the cats meow...gonna have to give it a little thought. What I think I may do is go ahead & use the tranny out of what I bought (if it's any good) to keep cost down, & this project from stalling out...If that's the case, I'll likely order one of those engines...

[number1cas]

The Argo transmission you have is actually an open differential and you will loose power on the side that slips.

While that is sorta true, you don't lose power, you lose traction and all the rotation will go to the side with the least resistance, after about 1 hour at the controls, you learn to compensate for that and simply apply a little brake on the spinning side, transferring power to the traction side. Applying the brake does have the effect of slowing one side down and causes the engine to have to work harder to overcome it. You will not feel that effect if you are in a situation where one side is spinning, as braking a set of tires that have no traction will not rob power, only transfer that power to the grip side. You will feel it while travelling down a trail and turning, the sharper the turn the more you will feel it. Effectively YOU are the traction control or limited slip system. After several days at the controls you won't even realize that you are doing it anymore.

[nairb35]

The t-20 in an argo I think would be the ultimate setup.With a 30hp diesel motor.

[Noel Woods]

Whether you go differential drive, t20, or hydraulic, it should be a great machine any which way you cut it. I look forward to seeing the build take place. Having gone thru the build process myself, I'll tell you its a lot of work, but it is fun, and the reward will be in the finished product.
FYI, if you go hydraulic, you can use any type of motor (horizontal, vertical, inline, rotary, etc.). Many folks with hydraulic machines don't realize that it doesn't take that much power to run the hydraulics. I have a Bobcat skidsteer loader, it weighs 3800 pounds and does well with only 25hp. The key though is to keep the engine in its ideal power band. I've seen the same concept on the Mudd Ox and other hydraulic machines. I also have a ZTR mower, its got a 27HP Kawasaki vertical engine, and as long as you are running it 3000 or so rpm, it does great. My point is to match your engine, to the hydraulic need. To do this you'll have to consult with your friends at the hydraulic shop. They can help with the pumps, drive motors, etc. I think that two drive motors is all that you really need. Mechanical drive will be more simple however. Whether its the differential system or a t20 system. My Swamp Fox weighs 800 pounds as it currently sits, and the 25 HP diesel is really more than it needs. Its a torque monster with power to spare throughout the power band. For an Argo sized vehicle you could get away with a 13HP diesel. More power is better though.

[Middlefork Miner]

Noel, how many hrs. do you have on it? Is there any kind of customer support for parts? I notice on one of the websites they list the injectors as bosch. But things like starters & such might be a problem???

[Noel Woods]

I've only got 50ish hours on the machine. I've had to purchase no new parts and the engine continues to run well. The supplier indicates that they have the ability to secure any parts. A-1 provides a one year warranty for parts as well on the purchase of any new engine. I have really been impressed on the build quality. It makes the Briggs 18HP in my Max 2 look like ancient technology. The best thing though is direct injection-there is absolutely no fuel starvation at any angle I've driven at, and I tend to push the limits. Throttle response is instant, torque is always there, economy is beyond anything I thought possible and the price is awesome.
Rumor has it that John Deere has cut a deal to use the Winsun diesels in their line-up. If anything, I think parts will be easy to get.

[amphibious drew]

Just checked the a-1biofuel site, and they are out of stock on everything but the 25hp. They said they are moving to a new factory and will be out of stock until late spring.

[Middlefork Miner]

I hope they have one available when my taxes are filed & the refund check is in my pocket...

[smog]

Just checked the a-1biofuel site, and they are out of stock on everything but the 25hp. They said they are moving to a new factory and will be out of stock until late spring.

I also heard they have reliability problems on the diesel motorcycle forums

[Middlefork Miner]

I also heard they have reliability problems on the diesel motorcycle forums

Problems such as???

[Middlefork Miner]

I hope they have one available when my taxes are filed & the refund check is in my pocket...

Well, after a LOT of thought, I finally pulled the trigger on one of the Winsun 25 hp diesel engines...I'm gonna go ahead & use the torque converter & tranny I pulled out of the Argo & see how it all goes...

[mudbug3]

Middlefork Miner

Noel Woods has had exellent reliability out of the 25 hp Winson diesel thats in his Super Swamp Fox.

[Middlefork Miner]

A brief update...After a couple weekends of taking measurements, doing eyeball calculations, tack welding & trying think 5 steps ahead, I finally got the engine/tranny mounted in their final resting place & did a test run on the bench... I fired up the diesel & throttled up & down & the belt alignment looks to be about perfect. One thing that I suspected might pop up did...& that was the belt turning the driven clutch at idle. It doesn't appear to be a problem though, as the transmission seemed to pop into high, low & reverse pretty easy with a very minimum of "clunk" & no grinding...I can adjust the belt tension down quite a bit if I need to, but then the belt doesn't sit in the driven clutch plate the 1/8" or so that I "think" that it needs to.
Anyways...I guess the next step is to clean out the garage so I'll have enough room to start building the frame...One question I'd like to throw out though is axle spacing? The frame is going to be 5" high & right now I'm thinking about centering the axles about 27 1/2 to 28 inches apart & the two center axles about an inch lower than the front & rear....can anybody think of any problems I might have doing this? FWIW, the plan right now is to mount the engine/transmission assembly just slightly to the rear of center.

[chris davison]

5 inches high and 27.5 is what I built mine because a 4 bolt flange brg fits perfect. How long is your frame and what size tires will you run?