I was just thinking

[Dave Flaherty]

WHY hasn't someone designed a set of tracks for an argo (could be any6 or 8 wheeler for that matter) that does away with all the driven wheels bar the front two to drive the tracks like a dozer .The belt could holes in it like a bobcat with tracks to drive it the rear axle could be the adjuster when the tracks stretch and you could do away with 6 chains and a heap of moving parts and weight.I may be just a dumb fitter and turner from down under but their is room for thought.

[Buzz]

a couple things come to mind. 1) the loss of bouyancy with the elimination of a tire, especially in the front. 2) in the event of track problems, you would no longer be able to rely on just "driving out on tires." There is a bit of redundancy built in to having an over-the-tire (driven tire) track. The key I think is to how to best match the end axles/tires with the track components as they are the only ones with a significant contact patch, which means potential resistance.

[Old Tucker]

I have thought of that to Buss. My thought was to go to a whole new system. the track would be a complete unit that would just bolt on to each side. And driven from a back sprocket. with side by side boogie wheels that the track could ride on. You could give her a lot more ground clearance and make it longer in front and taper it up in the front.
Now would be better to pull the track under from the back. or over the top from the front?
With the Tucker it was pulled from the top front. over the back on the pontoon. And any slack seemed to buckle in the front as it dropped to the ground and was pulled back under. All slack showed up in a two foot length of track right in front. Now if you pull the track from the back Your slack is spread over a lot longer section of track and is not a much of a problem. I have some nice aluminium rails I have been pondering over for the bougie support.
But to find the time. Along with ever thing else.

[shot410ga]

Why don't you just buy a small used "Cat?" If you want a tracked vehicle, there are lots of brands, Cat, Deer, International, etc. But, then they don't float to well....

[2014SE]

To redesign it to be a tracked vehicle like that is a whole new machine and not a argo (ox, maxx or what ever AATV) any more. The track system used is a addition to the AATV, all tracked vehicles have come and gone over the past 50 years and the wheeled AATV survived but the majority of tracked utility vehicles went the way of the dinosaur. Like Buzz mentioned your machine needs bouncy to stay afloat. Remove the air factor included in your tires and your going down, pretty simple logic there. Your all wheel option will be gone and theirs times when all wheels is wanted for practical or recreational reasons. If you remove the tires from the machine you will need a suspension system witch is more weight and less flotation.

As for front or rear track drive, tanks use front drive and cats rear drive. Rear drive and heavy tracks is for slow 2-3 mph drive and very high torque drive applications where pushing or pulling is the design application. If you add a speed factor (10 mph or more) you need front drive and a lighter track design or the track will whip uncontrollably and self destruct. Unfortunately rear drive and speed can't be combined with tracks. Even snow machines (skidoo) use a front drive.

Cost!!!

Most of us want a recreational vehicle and a all track design that floats would cost, to build such a machine would get up there, for amphibious applications a all tracked machine will most likely need propellers. With out tires the machine will sit lower in the water and even open tracks will likely not propel it through water as the top of the track will be under the surface and proportion from the under water forward driven part of the track will be canceled out by the tracks return over the top of the under carriage. Their is a awesome machine available with this kind of design available. Hydratrek. All hydraulic drive without chains and propellers and heavier design for longer running life and reliability and even this machine is built with tires driving the tracks with both front and rear drivers. Personally I could never justify paying that price for a toy, if it was a paying gig and it was working every day I'd be all over it like stink on a hippy.

Most people don't buy Escargo tracks because of cost. I can understand that but A whole redesigned machine with one dedicated driver will cost allot more than a set of Escargo's. Theirs plenty of designs of tracks available for the AATV user now, Escargo with all steel grousers, Adair with all UHMW, all rubber and of course the ole all plastic Argo tracks witch at the time was a amazing addition to a AATV!! Theirs guys home building combinations of these, some real good ideas but time trials, say 5 years will tell how those stand up to cold and use. Theirs advantages and disadvantages to all designs and we must decide on our own what machine and drive configuration we want.

[Old Tucker]

2014se If you look at the photos of my tucker. They used a pontoon idea so it would float better on the marshes.
As for cost I have seen people throw a lot of money out the window on a lot of projects that went nowhere. What the heck. We could give it to the government. and complain about how they waist it.
If you do not try to build or improve on something then you are happy with what the market throws at you. On your argo have you tried to come up with the best possible unit, for the use you are going to use it for? And the answer to that is yes.
Look at the tracks for the argo and how we all are trying to improve on them for different uses, Ice, sand, mud snow.
I say if you do not try then you will not know. You may just come up with a very unique idea that will work.

[2014SE]

2014se If you look at the photos of my tucker. They used a pontoon idea so it would float better on the marshes.
As for cost I have seen people throw a lot of money out the window on a lot of projects that went nowhere. What the heck. We could give it to the government. and complain about how they waist it.
If you do not try to build or improve on something then you are happy with what the market throws at you. On your argo have you tried to come up with the best possible unit, for the use you are going to use it for? And the answer to that is yes.
Look at the tracks for the argo and how we all are trying to improve on them for different uses, Ice, sand, mud snow.
I say if you do not try then you will not know. You may just come up with a very unique idea that will work.

Yes we do tend at times to spend time and $$ on projects. I do it myself, more than meany. Some of the best inventions are from guys like you and I in our garage or designed out of necessity.

I never noticed that little picture till now, that looks like a unique vehicle from what I can see in such a small picture.

[Dozerlarry]

" As for front or rear track drive, tanks use front drive and cats rear drive. Rear drive and heavy tracks is for slow 2-3 mph drive and very high torque drive applications where pushing or pulling is the design application. If you add a speed factor (10 mph or more) you need front drive and a lighter track design or the track will whip uncontrollably and self destruct. Unfortunately rear drive and speed can't be combined with tracks. Even snow machines (skidoo) use a front drive."

Exactly which USA tanks are you referring to that have front drive sprockets? You're going to have to go back to WW2 to find some. All current tanks are rear drive and they are all quite fast.

[Lantz]

The same company that makes (or did make?) the AV4 also makes a tracked amphibious vehicle called the "Amphi-Track".... Kind of off topic but I wanted to throw that out there.
SNO-BUS Mfg. Co., Inc. Sportsman's Products

[Old Tucker]

Yes we do tend at times to spend time and $$ on projects. I do it myself, more than meany. Some of the best inventions are from guys like you and I in our garage or designed out of necessity.

I never noticed that little picture till now, that looks like a unique vehicle from what I can see in such a small picture.

This track system gave the snow cat to much traction and you could not turn it very well at all. One other snow cat came out of Germany (I think) about the same time and it danced circles around this one. The tucker could tow six of the of the other ones. The german snow cat had a very unique suspension system. Where the back third of the track floated up and down. putting the vast majority of the weight two thirds back from the front. making the front lighter. and it turned on a dime. It also had a rubber track. Both cats weighed about the same. Both had a small VW engine. Both were a two track skid steer. Tucker went for traction. And it did not work in the heavy unit.They also used a pontoon so it could float better on the marshes.

[IMG][/IMG]

[Old Tucker]

Sorry I was hopping the photo would be bigger

[Old Tucker]

Lets try again
First photo is my cat
seconds is the one that danced circles around mine
[IMG][/IMG]

I like this one.. See the difference in the track system

[IMG][/IMG]

[Buzz]

Old Tucker- I usually see a few of those snow-tracs every year out on the lake at the Iditarod Re-start in Willow. I've seen them skooting across the lake at a pretty good clip.

[Old Tucker]

I love the theory behind the suspension system that allows it to turn so easy. B.C.tel bought a whole fleet of then.
they were quit popular. Back then.

Again two different companies, Different ideas one worked and the other did not.

[shot410ga]

My mistake, the Marine Corps uses a tracked vehicle that floats. The Amtrack. Holds about 8 grunts and has water jets for propulsion in the water. You could maybe get a surplus one for a few million? Why reinvent the wheel, if you've got the cash?