Argo Tires/Rims on a Max

[Eldon]

I am toying with the idea of putting the 24" Argo Frontier tire on my Max II.I know it has been done at least with the tires.Super in water and pretty good in mud.When compared to the 22 inch Rawhide IIIs they are definitely better in water and possibly a better ride but there is not much clearance and I have heard that the sidewall in the Argo tire will puncture easier than the Rawhide tire.Will an Argo rim work on a Max and has anyone else tried it??
It is a relatively expensive purchase but I can purchase these from Argo here in Canada for less than I can have 6 rims and 22 inch Rawhide IIIs shipped to Canada from Max.

[Mike]

An Argo rim will work on a Max however if you have to buy new ones anyway you should purchase some Mudd Ox wheels since their beadlock is superior to Argo's. You can still buy the tires there in Canada and have someone local install them for you. That way you would be much less likely to lose a bead on the trail. Just a thought.

[Roger S]

I think he's talkin' about the 8" frontier tire, and not the 9" big brother. Yes argo wheels will bolt up, the argo wheels need regular lug nuts and not the flat faced nuts. The argo 8" wheel is a little narrower than a max k lock, can't say which is better for this app, the narrow wheel would tuck in and be protected from rocks a little more. The wheels that come on frontiers seem to hold as well as a k lock, but I've seen these tires put on older argo 8" wheels and they sometimes dismount. so if I used argo wheels I'd buy frontier wheels and tires. If you used max k locks it might make the tires slightly shorter and fatter. (the argo wheels is 7" wide, the max is 7.5 or 8?

The carcass is a little flimsy, lots or people have damaged them. My friends thrashed them hard for a couple years with no problems, buut eventually started having to plug punctures or rim pinches. But they tore up rawhide III's before that..

[egoperf]

i had the argo tires on my max with klock rims. the ride was great they where fast going forward in the water. the bad, they do not go backwards in the water at all, the sidewall is very soft, on agressive turns they tend to fold under digging the rim in the ground and increase the risk of flipping. also the sidewall is very prone to puncture

[Eldon]

I have learned a lot from this posting folks and I appreciate the input.The Mudd Ox wheels are 9 inch?I also wasn't aware of the difference in lug nuts.part of the reason for the improved ride I think is in addition to a higher sidewall the sidewall is also softer not all good news there.The Max with 21 inch Rawhides is no ball of fire in reverse in the water either but it will go back.I really would like the 22 inch Rawhide IIIs before they are unobtainable but trouble is only place I can source them is from RI they are very obliging but the costs even with our dollars fairly close are $160 per tire/wheel plus $50 per tire/wheel shipping then when they get here I have to put the transaction through an import broker for as yet unknown broker fees possible duty then we get to the local taxes LOL.I can have RI ship to the UPS warehouse in Houlton Maine and pick them up myself and pay only local taxes but it is difficult.There isn't a Canadian Max dealer within 2000 miles of me . The Argo wheels and tires are $196 per tire/wheel an hours drive from my house.My main concern is....even without any known body sag do you think there is sufficient clearance.I estimate not hardly any distance over the 1 1/2 inch over the 21 inch Rawhides on the middle and front wheels.Boys I appreciate your input.

[Roger S]

John Schwab said they'd fit his II that has an external muffler, they're about 23 and a 1/4-1/2" tall, usually at 2.5 psi.

Yeah the mudd ox wheel is the same dimensions as the argo 9x10 wheel.

[Eldon]

If they stand the full 24" high I think it would be too tight on the front wheels but at the figures of 23 1/4-23 1/2 it would just fit.The middle and rear wheels are OK for sure.LOL I'd hate to put out that kind of money and not have it fit.( $1300).

[Robinhood02]

so does this mean you have a set of 21" that you would trade for a set of 22 ", ?? i have a set of 22" that are "like new" for trade

[Eldon]

Thanks Charlie: I can't trade my 21's as I need them for my tracks.Why don't we talk about the 22's for sale. LOL. Are they mounted on "K" rims or just the tires? Eldon

[Robinhood02]

sorry Eldon i cant sell them I need 21s in trade or my unit wont have tires on it LOL

[lewis]

Just a little info on the Argo tires. These are the 25x12x9 inch new style tire that Argo puts on all the new Avengers. I am not a tires expert by no means, just a user.

Due to the design of the thread on these tires they are great in water and mud. The square design profile gives it a unique look and in my opinion excellent pulling ability. Just like any new item that hits the market you will have to adjust to it's capabilities.
(1) all tires are within 1/4 inch (circumference) of each other which eliminates the bouncing action as you ride due to the tire stretching and acquiring high spots.
(2) Excellent swim ability forward, not as good in reverse but will get you out of a tight spot. Mine are Installed to swim.
(3) Pretty tough tires and not easy to puncher, but i have managed to do it anyway. Installed tube and works fine.
(4) front tires have Matto rims. All others have Argo rims.
NOTE: Only tires that ever came off the bead are the fronts.???? These tires will not loose their shape when the
pressure gets low. They will need to checked prior to each ride. Take nothing for grated.
(5) Found from riding that the magic number is 7psi in front 2 tires and 5 psi in all others. Seems high but they will not de-bead and the ride is not that bad since trail riding is not at a high speed and on smooth roads they are fine also.
(6) Each ride i would start with a low pressure and knocked the front tires off each ride.
Started with Argo rims on front and then went to Matto rims. Still the same result. Then would add air until 7 psi and no more problems. This years April Busco ride no tires were knocked off the rims.
(7) My opinion on why the tires come off: Most of the trails have narrow ruts as you approach/exit the mud hole where 4 wheelers have traveled. These are in the shape of a (v) some what exaggerated but you get the idea. The Argo tires are more of a cement block square design. The mechanical force is more than even the Matto rims can take, (side pressure) which will de-bead the tire. With the added pressure 7 psi the tires seem to hold the bead and preform very well. This ride knock on wood, no tires were knocked off the bead. This ride was started with the combination of tire pressure that i mentioned above.
(8) performance was good and ride was more pleasant due to not having to re-install these tires.
(9) Now a lot of you may think the ride would be terrible but it is not.

I don't know how many members have these style tires, but this is just the above mentioned items that i have been working with so as to get the most out of my tires.

By no means am i a tires expert, but these are just the events that i have experienced and my solutions to the problem if you would call it a problem.

Compared to the Rawhide III side wall damage these tires(Argo Avenger) have not suffered the same fate. This may be due to the flat design on the side wall and the fact that they are 4-ply.

Would i recommend them to others, the answer is: Yes, but remember there is no perfect tire. These are just MY thoughts and experiences with the new style tire and it's use.

The new Frontier tire is of the same basic design and hope this is of some help. Interested as to the performance of the Frontier tire compared to the Avenger Argo tire.




Lewis

[Roger S]

Thanks for the input, Lewis. The vids looked like you were running a lot of psi and I figured it was the argo wheels. Matt's wheels don't have as high of a bead as a k lock, their holding ability is in part due to a slightly larger diameter than the argo wheels. Also the more times a tire bead goes off and on, it gets stretched and is a looser fit. I've seen this happen on 22" rawhide III's and 22" super swampers on k locks that had been on different wheels and had some age. It's the tire and wheel fit, not just wheels. You'll very seldom see a runamuk fall off an argo wheel, but a rawhide III won't stay on at all on the same wheel. If I ran those tires (which I can't) I'd try my permatex High Tack glue on them.

[Eldon]

LOL you could put skis on it.I could have bought a 1999 Max IV out of Nova Scotia with new 21's,new 26's and tracks barely used for $4000 .but they had broke an axle on it by overinflating the tires with the tracks on so I was nervous of all axles,bearings etc..It looked good too.Why do you want 21's Charlie? Tracks?

[Roger S]

Lewis, do you remember what the diameter of the HDI tires are, and at what pressure?

[lewis]

Not right off hand Roger, but give me a little time and i will measure them at the different pressures. Due to the fact that they are 4-ply the diameter will not change much. They barely show any change when the pressure is low.