Track Tuners ?

[North Country Tough]

Hey guys great info,looks promising for the track tuners,got a question for both you fellas before I put out the money for them I strictly run tracks in the winter will I still need these units.N.C.T

[Rock Doctor]

I'm running 4.5 psi in my tires (5 psi in the ones that leak, lol)

RD

[DerekF]

Tim,

So far it looks like there is no pressure on the bottom side of the chain. So if memory serves me correct, Argo specs call for 7psi on the two inner tires, and 5 psi on the end wheels? And you are saying to run 6psi on all tires?

Derek

[Obsessed]

Well, an update. I ordered a set of track tuners about a month ago, they arrived a few weeks ago and I finally got an opportunity to put them on. My first impression is that I liked them, easy to grease, quality looks good. The only issue on the install was that the wheel bolts on the track tunes are larger than the wheel bolts on the argo axle shafts, (3/4 for argo, 13/16 for track tuners if memory serves me right) This made the bolt on the tuners the exactly the same size as the bolt pattern wheel hole and if the wheel holes are squished a bit from cranking the tires tight you have to ream the holes out to get the wheels on. No big deal though.

I tried them out yesterday. I would run the machine up for a few minutes and then check the chains, etc. All the windup issues that I seemed to be plagued with, with my rubber tracks, seemed to be gone. (And I should say that I do know how to set the tracks up, but I still felt like there was too much chain 'back pressure' for my liking) I then would check the chain tighteners to see if they had ratcheted up. None of them had moved. So, just to check, I loosed off my tensioners right off, ran the argo, the chain tensioners did not ratchet up past the point of where they were with tires only.

Yesterday I took the machine for a good workout. It turns easier, climbs better, all the funny creaking, straining sounds that I disliked with tracks on seem to be gone. There appears to be much less pressure on the drive system with these on.

All in all, so far, I am very very happy with the difference. I will take some video and post it.

Derek

DerekF.....if you want to completely neutralize chain load...

Assuming that the tires are still installed in the factory location based on their size (smallest in front and second smallest in the rear) and also assuming that those two smallest tires are within an inch or so of one another...then you can adjust the remaining chain tension and completely eliminate it by increasing the front tire psi by 1psi and decrease the rear tire by 1psi...if you continue this you will completely eliminate the chain windup.....but.....if you go to far you will start to reverse the load on the chains and start to put the stress on the bottom side of all chain loops that are behind the transmission and directly on the chain tensioners (just what the Argo engineers are trying to eliminate by staggering the tire sizes as they have)...

Second thing to understand is that with a slight amount of tension on the top of the rear drive chains (away from the chain tensioners) you are preloading the drive system (a good thing) so that if and when slight slippage occurs both front and rear tire are synchronized and thus eliminating any chance of "shocking" the drive system...

Final point of concern is rear tire pressure...better than 90% of the time, tracks derail under three specific circumstances
1. A side load on the track while skidding, sliding, or turning
2. The rear rear tire must be rotating at least slightly
3. The rear tire has to give and the track is pealed off the bottom of the rear tire

With this in mind sharp turns, with a firmer rear tire and proper track tension will pretty much eliminate any possibility of throwing a track

Take care and let me know if any of this doesnt make sense

Tim

[Rock Doctor]

I also would like a pic of these track tuners and how do they freewheel the center wheel

RD

[BREEZE]

I also would like a pic of these track tuners and how do they freewheel the center wheel

[DerekF]

Well, an update. I ordered a set of track tuners about a month ago, they arrived a few weeks ago and I finally got an opportunity to put them on. My first impression is that I liked them, easy to grease, quality looks good. The only issue on the install was that the wheel bolts on the track tunes are larger than the wheel bolts on the argo axle shafts, (3/4 for argo, 13/16 for track tuners if memory serves me right) This made the bolt on the tuners the exactly the same size as the bolt pattern wheel hole and if the wheel holes are squished a bit from cranking the tires tight you have to ream the holes out to get the wheels on. No big deal though.

I tried them out yesterday. I would run the machine up for a few minutes and then check the chains, etc. All the windup issues that I seemed to be plagued with, with my rubber tracks, seemed to be gone. (And I should say that I do know how to set the tracks up, but I still felt like there was too much chain 'back pressure' for my liking) I then would check the chain tighteners to see if they had ratcheted up. None of them had moved. So, just to check, I loosed off my tensioners right off, ran the argo, the chain tensioners did not ratchet up past the point of where they were with tires only.

Yesterday I took the machine for a good workout. It turns easier, climbs better, all the funny creaking, straining sounds that I disliked with tracks on seem to be gone. There appears to be much less pressure on the drive system with these on.

All in all, so far, I am very very happy with the difference. I will take some video and post it.

Derek

[North Country Tough]

Thanks Doc,as far as wind up issues for me nothing major yet,mind you I use it mostly for plowing and the constant go this way go the other way turn spin probably helps,the other reason is there has been only two storms this year and the snow was gone 3 days later,the sun comes out and its 50 degrees again.Wont likely take it to the cottage this winter we are still trying to get enough snowmobiling in,been a lousy winter here.N.C.T

[Rock Doctor]

Not really anything to report. The Track Tuners are working fine (keeping in mind that they are not needed on Adair Tracks anyway).
Have NOT had much time to do any more testing, Work and cold temps have limited our riding. This weekend is supposed to be really nice though, so I should be putting a few hours on the Conquests.

Couple things:
Have not had any issues with Ice Buildup on the Adair Tracks that might effect the Tuners, but I have not run through any "overflow" yet this winter.
Have not had any tire slip issues in the tracks while using Tuners. The actual contact surface of the middle tires to the tracks is almost nothing, so I don't see much of an issue with only driving the tracks with the front and rear tires (your analogy of having 4 guys push a stuck truck instead of 2 should really be more like 2 guys and a midget pushing as opposed to just the 2 guys). Problems could arise if you get a flat on the front or back tire though.


RD

[North Country Tough]

Any report on them out of BC yet still watchin Doc.

[Buzz]

Sure sounds like a great idea to run different size tires or for use with rubber tracks in "non-snow" conditions. (high friction inside tracks). However, the problem I have run into during the winter (with rubber tracks)....is that when crossing patches of water or slush, I've had the water freeze making ice on the inside of the track. When climbing an incline afterward, the tires slip inside the tracks. Sure, you can overcome this sometimes with momentum and feathering of the throttle, but not always. Sometimes the wheel force needed to turn the tracks and propel the machine up the hill is more than the force of friction remaining on the inside of the tracks. I can't help but think having 4 tires inside each track "helping" would definitely be better than 2.....kind of like having 4 guys pushing your stuck car on the snow while wearing slippery shoes versus just 2 guys pushing. To be fair, I've never run just the front and rear axles with tracks, and they are the most important wheels when using tracks. I sure would like to know if just 2 axles turning would be more apt to slip inside the tracks. What does a set of track tuner's cost?

[DerekF]

any updates on these? Pricing? I have been avoiding running my rubber tracks this winter because of windup. If these work I want a set!

[tattooman]

Sounds incredible

[Obsessed]

Anyone have a picture of these tracks turners on the adiar tacks

tattooman, "track tuners" are not normally used on adair tracks or any other type of of plastic track as these types of tracks do not create the chain windup issues.. They are intended for over the tire style rubber tracks and other track designs that actually run the track belting on a different circumfrence than the outside tip of the tires which causes the center tires to spin faster than the tracks.. Rock Doctor is attempting a unique application where he is wanting to run larger than normal 24" tires on the four middle axles, and then normal size 22" tires on the front and back axles.. If this works for him then there will be an increase in ground clearance as well as an improved approach and departure angle by lifting the front and rear of the track similar to the current frame design on newer 8x8 machines. "Track tuners" will allow the center tires to free wheel and eliminate the binding that would normally prevent this type of modification..

Hope this make some sense

[tattooman]

Anyone have a picture of these tracks turners on the adiar tacks