t-20 homemade shift kit

[Sandcassle]

My Hustler has the split shift setup and it is very hard to shift. I've disconnected the shifter cables from the t-20 and tried to shift the diamonds at the transmission itself. Even when rocking the machine, the transmission is hard to shift.

I'm either going to purchase the spring shifter kit from R. Clark or I'll fabricate this kit myself. Has anyone here in this forum designed their own shift kit from hardware store parts?

[Mike]

If you are having trouble shifting it at the transmission itself, then you have other issues. You should be able to hold a little pressure on the diamond shifter and roll the machine just a little bit either forward or reverse. The shifter should just fall into place.

If it's not, then the springs aren't going to help you. I think they would cause more trouble since something doesn't seem right. With a split shifter setup you shouldn't need the springs anyway since you can shift one side and then the other.

I'm not trying to discourage you from making a spring assist but something just doesn't sound right here. Are both sides of the transmission equally difficult to shift at the transmission?

[Sandcassle]

hard shifting

I'm not trying to discourage you from making a spring assist but something just doesn't sound right here. Are both sides of the transmission equally difficult to shift at the transmission?

Yep, both of them are about the same. They will shift with some encouragement, but unacceptably hard to shift. Isn't this a common trait of the T-20?

[Amphiman1]

shift kit?

i personally , would fabricate my own,,, see what other members have done.. ask,,,,,,,,,,,

[Mike]

Yes, it can be hard to shift but usually the reason is because you are shifting both sides at the same time though lots of linkage. When you have a split shifter that eliminates half of the problem right there.

Regardless, at the T20 itself, it shouldn't be an issue. If you have it in neutral, you should be able to just hold the diamond shifter forward with your finger and when you roll the 6x6 forward, the T20 should fall into gear. It shouldn't be hard to shift there.

[brushcutter]

Sandcassle,
If you have the machine in neutral do the shift diamonds move freely a short distance and then get hard or are they hard to move from the neutral position?Have you pulled the shift diamonds to see if there could be a problem internally?what is the story on the tranny-new,rebuilt,freshened up or just used?I've got to go to work will check back this evening.

[Sandcassle]

Hard shifting T-20

Sandcassle,
If you have the machine in neutral do the shift diamonds move freely a short distance and then get hard or are they hard to move from the neutral position?Have you pulled the shift diamonds to see if there could be a problem internally?what is the story on the tranny-new,rebuilt,freshened up or just used?I've got to go to work will check back this evening.

Brushcutter,

When I have the machine in neutral, the shift diamonds do move freely for a short distance before they get hard. This would seem to be normal to me. You know, what it really feels like is that it has no lubrication and the hard shifting is caused by the friction between the metal to metal contact of the shift components inside the transmission. I do know the transmission is serviced (with auto tranny fluid).
I have not pulled the diamonds yet to investigate this problem.

As for as the story on the tranny-new, rebuilt, etc., I have researched this and have come to the following conclusion: When the machine was still relatively new, the transmission was damaged due to improper shifting. The transmission was repaired. I have the Borg Warner T-20 Service Manual with this machine and it has part numbers underlined and other notes for ordering parts. Additionally, there is a hand written note from the Hustler company warning that improper shifting will damage the transmission. Do I smell some sort of warranty dispute here? You know the story, almost new machine gets tranmission damaged due to improper shifting, owner tries to get manufacturer to repair "faulty" transmission, the manufacturer balks, but yet they work out some sort of agreement and the transmission gets repaired.

Thanks for your help,
Roy

[Mike]

It really sounds like it is in normal operating condition the way you describe it shifting? When you said unacceptably hard to shift in your first post maybe that is what's throwing me? I mean, how much pressure are you having to put on it to get it to shift?

Assuming that something is wrong, I would start by inspecting the fluid to see if it has enough, is clean, doesn't have shavings in it, etc. Then pull the diamond shifters out and see if the pins are in tact. Also make sure that the bores that the shifters are in don't have any scoring or damage that would make the shifters difficult to turn within the case itself.

From there you can put a screw driver on the shift collars and see if they move freely. Just cover the end of the screw driver with a rag so that you do not damage the shift collars.



There will be a little more resistance using a screw driver since you do not have the same leverage as with the diamond shifter but you should be able to overcome the detent spring and shift it while rolling the six wheeler or turning the output shaft.

[Sandcassle]

I found a couple problems

Ok, I've made a little progress. I found 2 problems contributing to the hard shifting. First of all, the push-pull control cables were improperly adjusted, causing the shifter diamonds on the transmission to travel too far when shifted into forward gear. This caused an "over center" condition which essentionally locked the shifter into forward gear. I adjusted the travel of the push-pull controls to limit the travel when shifting into forward, thus eliminating the "over center" locking condition.
Secondly, while being shifted into forward gear, the shifter lever was practically parallel with the floorboard and there was zero clearance between the lever and floorboard, therefore not allowing enough room for the fingers to go around the lever for a good grip. Without this firm grip, it was difficult to have the proper feel to shift forcefully-with-finesse. My fingertips just didn't have the correct feel, because this transmission requires a little effort to shift. To correct this I bent the shifter levers up a few degrees to allow for some clearance to grip it.

This isn't a very nice shifting transmission, perhaps due to the design. It reminds me of how my old '41 Chevy truck shifted...crudely. But at least now I can shift. Before it was practically impossible.

Thanks for everyones help.
Roy

[brushcutter]

Roy,
What kind of split shifter did Hustler install at the factory?I have heard of them but have as yet to see one.I don't think anyone here will dispute that the T-20 can be temperamental to shift at times.But man what a tranny it is!One thing that I have learned,when shifting into either forward or reverse and before applying throttle, give the siicks a LIGHT bump to front or back and you should feel the machine lurch slightly this helps the gears allign and lets you know they are engaged.Then lightly apply throttle as you push (or pull) the sticks.This seems to help prevent the dreaded GRIND.Works for me any how.Gregg

[Sandcassle]

Well, here it is 4 ½ years later and I finally resolved my hard shifting problem. My machine has been stored since. So I decided to go ahead and fabricate my own shift kit. I did and it works great! I would be glad to help anyone out with this mod if you have the same Hustler split shifter set up like I have. I’m guessing this was found on the last models.
Here’s a few pics.
My Slideshow - YouTube