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Detonated Primary Clutch (ARGO)

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  • Detonated Primary Clutch (ARGO)

    So, I was just getting ready for bed the other night, and the phone rings (10:30pm). A friend is on the line, and he tells me that he is broke down about 8 miles from his truck, and that he would really appreciate some help. He said his clutch just exploded and he's wondering if I have a spare, and if I will bring it out to him? I asked "What clutch". He said the clutch on his Argo. I said which clutch on your Argo? He said the "little one". I said "You mean the Primary Clutch?". He said "I don't know, the one at the front". I said "You mean the one on the Engine?". He sais, "yes, do you have a spare?".
    "I have a spare for both, I just have to put them togeather"
    He sais, " I don't need both, just the small one" (Famous last words)

    OK, OK, I'll see what I can do. See you in the morning, have a nice night, hope you have lots of bug spray.

    Can you bring me a belt too?

    Anyway, I gather up some stuff that I want to take out to my cabin (he's on the way), and load up some parts and tools. (Finally get to bed about midnight)

    I leave early the next morning, and find his Argo, no sign of him though (He walked to his cabin, another 2 miles down the trail)

    I checked things out, and find that both the Primary and Secondary are damaged (Of course), and I only brought out a Primary.

    My theory is that he lost one of the little slider buttons off the Secondary, and that ended up taking out his Primary.

    I did what I could, with what I had, and ended up going to get him and limping his Argo the rest of the way to his Cabin.
    He told me that he knew something was wrong within a mile of where he left his truck, but couldn't figure out what it was??????? Personally, I think it would have been smarter to turn around and go back to the truck, than keep heading further away from it, but what do I know.

    Anyway, it was worth a vid, so you can check it out if you want (Might have to wait for the vid to finish processing for better quality)
    I left him out there, but have made araingments to fly a new Secondary out to him later this week.




    RD

  • #2
    He's awfully lucky to have a friend like you.

    That looks like a great place to ride- does it dry out later in the season or stay swampy until the snow comes back?
    Stuck in the seventies- not in the swamp.

    (6) Attex, a Hustler, a Super Swamp Fox, (2) Tricarts, (3) Tri-sports, a Sno-co trike, 3 Dunecycles, and a Starcraft! ...so far

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    • #3
      I didn't think Rock Doctors made house calls anymore. I'm sure he knows it, but your friend owes you big time. Some day he might not be lucky enough to get a hold of you.

      Bridget

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Don View Post
        He's awfully lucky to have a friend like you.

        That looks like a great place to ride- does it dry out later in the season or stay swampy until the snow comes back?
        This trail NEVER dries out, Muskeg trail from HELL. I managed to get some great vid from the rest of the trip, but have not had any time to make something of it yet. Hope to make a clip or two soon.

        Originally posted by Model Citizen View Post
        I didn't think Rock Doctors made house calls anymore. I'm sure he knows it, but your friend owes you big time. Some day he might not be lucky enough to get a hold of you.

        Bridget
        LOL, He is a good old guy, but not particularily "mechanical", so I don't mind helping him out. He will pay me back in one way or another. Normally I tell guys that a Callout is a min of 4hrs at "Double Time", but in this case, if I let him figure out what's fair, I will come out ahead and then some. He treats me good and I kinda like the old fart.

        RD

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        • #5
          Way to go RD, Nice to see ,going out of your way to help a friend. By the looks of the empty cans, he really appreciates your help. Mike

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          • #6
            I love your videos! He is lucky. Thanks for sharing.

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            • #7
              I got to ask what kind of cam are you using? Great quality video.
              sigpic

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              • #8
                thanks rock doc you all ways have great videos . robbie
                1999 max 2 18 b&s 22 tires custom . new max iv 23 k 26 i/n tires brown . ht cable promark winch . new toy 1972 attex st400 400ccjlo and she will be bad . ( the frog ) if it don't float with out you getting wet . don't bring it ! R.I.P sage rogers 4 11 09 . you can't fix stuped !!!!! raceone 3 .)

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Toys4Me View Post
                  I got to ask what kind of cam are you using? Great quality video.
                  It's a VIO POV1, got it from "helmetcameracentral.com". I think the latest version is a POV1.5
                  I think my editing softwhere is as responsible as the camera for the quality
                  Originally posted by rdr View Post
                  thanks rock doc you all ways have great videos . robbie
                  Thanks Robbie, stay tuned, I have lots of footage from that trip and will try to make some clips shortly.

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                  • #10
                    sweetttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt tttttttt thanks rock doc
                    1999 max 2 18 b&s 22 tires custom . new max iv 23 k 26 i/n tires brown . ht cable promark winch . new toy 1972 attex st400 400ccjlo and she will be bad . ( the frog ) if it don't float with out you getting wet . don't bring it ! R.I.P sage rogers 4 11 09 . you can't fix stuped !!!!! raceone 3 .)

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Detonating Clutches...

                      Sorry to bring this thread back, but lately there's been a few comments about Argo clutches "puking pucks" at speeds above the governed limits. I'm concerned about taking a govener off both an Avenger and a Conquest as part of a project.

                      The primary in this thread looks like it separated at the base of the inner sheave, so no large flying weights. The real concern is losing a primary clutche's weights at higher rpms. They weigh almost a pound and if things come apart at 5k rpm, it would be a grenade.

                      Someone mentioned one coming apart recently, inlcuding tossing its weight. Any insight if they're prone to high rpm fatigue/failure. The primary is the same design as many snowmobiles that regularly run 6k rpm or more. Is it just the Argo's odd heavy pucks that may cause a high rpm failure?

                      Any experiences or thoughts welcome.

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                      • #12
                        I think I'm the experienced puck puker here..

                        '97 response. I tossed a weight at 6000 rpm with the 18 vanguard. Thought the world was coming to an end. Thought the engine had grenaded. Talk about a vibration. Anyway, it's those hollow phenolic pucks that hold the lead slug that crack and fail, and allow the weight to get mashed out of shape, or come clear out. I said they were a pound, but think it's about a half pound each. I think if a guy replaced those pucks every year or two ($15 total) and stayed under 5000 rpm it would be ok. I'm testing that theory now. Stock engines aren't going to make power over 4000 anyway. I think heat make them brittle and then the added rpm doesn't help. Making the weights lighter helps, and is what you do to raise the operating rpm.

                        The avenger pucks and weights are different, from the pics I've seen. Looks like an intergated part, solid. No experience with them myself.
                        To Invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. (Thomas Edison)

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                        • #13
                          Hello RD, It could be a good buisness, Argo House call for stranded Hunters of fishermans Just joking... Your buddy is really lucky to have you... I just have one silly question... With no clutch, could you have, like two, small or medium, fixed pulley, that you can slip a belt of any kind over to be abble to move the machine in case of massive clutch faillures...

                          Martwell

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                          • #14
                            Hey Roger, thanks for the info. The Avenger pucks are 275 grams or about 3/4 lb. They're also the same design as the Conquest's of some sort of polymer material shoe with a rectangular weight in the middle.

                            The Argo's clutch design is a bit iffy for high rpm compared to a snowmobile type hinged lever weight like on the Polaris P85-90. Both have their issues at high rpm, related to fatigue, but a loose puck at that weight and rpm would be a problem. Even with the small weights, snowmobiles make a pretty spectacular messes of the sleds when they let go. "Grenade" is commonly used.

                            I think your right about replacing/inspecting the shoes regularly. The muffler and heat shields also makes a pretty good scatter shield, but it might be a good idea to have a second one at about 1-4 o'clock, or even all the way to 9 to protect the tub.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by martwell View Post
                              Hello RD, It could be a good buisness, Argo House call for stranded Hunters of fishermans Just joking... Your buddy is really lucky to have you... I just have one silly question... With no clutch, could you have, like two, small or medium, fixed pulley, that you can slip a belt of any kind over to be abble to move the machine in case of massive clutch faillures...

                              Martwell
                              LOL, I think that might be possible, but not sure how practical it would be. If you were to put a small shive (pully) on the engine and a larger one on the trans, with a tight belt on between, you would have a "direct drive", and the machine would start moving as soon as it was started. It would also stall as soon as you applied brakes to stop. If you had a loose belt between the pulleys, you would need an idler pully that was moveable to take up the slack in the belt to get going, and release to stop.

                              All in All, I think that just keeping your clutches in good shape would eliminate MOST problems that might occur on the trail. Also, it would not hurt to have a few spare parts. For example: this guy knew SOMETHING was wrong early in the trip. If he had looked at the clutches and seen the missing "Slider Button", and IF he had spares, he could have saved himself some trouble by replacing it at that time. I firmly believe that it was the missing slider button on the Secondary that caused the Primary to fail.

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