What tranny do I have and what's wrong?

[photomd]

I have a Max II with a Tecumseh 18hp motor. Judging from the engine number, my Max II is from the late 80's. I rebuilt the electrical system and the carb last fall. However, when I got the ATV, the tranny was dry. I filled it with 80w140 GL5 gear fluid and it seemed to work well. It's been at a farm and I haven't used it for the last 6 weeks. I started it up and now get no drive to the left wheels when I push the bars forward. When I pull back, now the right wheels will reverse while the main gear selector is in forward. The linkages all look OK, but don't know what tranny I have or how to service it. Is there a manual? Did the fluid I put in mess up some sort of clutch system? Where should I start? Thanks in advance for any help y'all can lend.

[thebuggyman1]

I have a Max II with a Tecumseh 18hp motor. Judging from the engine number, my Max II is from the late 80's. I rebuilt the electrical system and the carb last fall. However, when I got the ATV, the tranny was dry. I filled it with 80w140 GL5 gear fluid and it seemed to work well. It's been at a farm and I haven't used it for the last 6 weeks. I started it up and now get no drive to the left wheels when I push the bars forward. When I pull back, now the right wheels will reverse while the main gear selector is in forward. The linkages all look OK, but don't know what tranny I have or how to service it. Is there a manual? Did the fluid I put in mess up some sort of clutch system? Where should I start? Thanks in advance for any help y'all can lend.

Yup, my guess you need a rebuild now. You have a t-20, and thru some years they used a glue on the band material that was soluble in gear lube. The proper fluid is ATF.
You also fill to the bottom plug...it takes one Qt. from bone dry. Here's the link to the rebuild "how to" http://www.6x6world.com/forums/conte...kid-steer.html
Where are you located?

[photomd]

Bummer....not the news I wanted to hear. I appreciate the help. Should I change the fluid and see what happens?

[Mike]

You can try that but if you do, you risk causing further damage to the drums. If I were you, I would take buggyman's advise and at least split the transmission case apart and take a look at the brake bands to see if the material is worn. You can have the bands relined rather inexpensively but replacing all four drums can add up fast.

[thebuggyman1]

It only takes about a half hour to get he trans out of a MaxII, but, BUT, about 2 hrs to put it back........Why is that. lol

If you post up your location another local member may volunteer to help.
Just remember: beer=free labor

[photomd]

Thanks for y'all's help. I'm located in Florence, SC. I really appreciate places like this that help with these little spots we get ourselves in.

[russriders]

Hey photomd I think u need to do Wht mike say bc if u keep try to ride Ur max u will be mess up more in side of Ur t20 .I live in piedmont , sc if u can come this way I can help u out on Ur t20 pm me I give u my phone #

[photomd]

Ok...The tranny is apart and surprisingly in pretty good shape.



I "think" the bands are OK, but the devil is in details. So I need more help. Here's how they look.





I think the drum are going to clean up. There's no gouges or marks on the machined surface. The bearings on the output shafts are "rumbly": I think I'll replace them.

Here's the drums:






So here's what I don't know.

1. The bands: Can I clean the gear oil off the bands and be good? Will the material come apart later? If they need to be resurface, where do I send them?
2. Where do I get seals, orings, bearings and c-clips (two c-clips were slightly injured in this exercise)?
3. Anything else I need to know? I did such a good job servicing the tranny, I'd hate to miss an opportunity to screw something else up. This is a good example that I need to work on my google-fu.

[amphibious drew]

I had gear oil in my first t20 also. Jay from recreatives told me to just use the parts washer on them. If you don't have one of those, just use brake cleaner on them. There is no real way to know if your bands will delaminate or even brake until you put the ATF III in and try them out. I've heard rumors of bands looking perfect and popping first run after getting the gear oil out and using the proper stuff. The bands could delaminate relatively rapidly after switching back. You kind of just want to keep an eye on them after a few good uses. As for parts, just call recreative industries and get them from there. You could get some of the generic parts elsewhere, but the gasket kit and input shaft bearing must come from RI. The input shaft is a stock bearing that is ground down a a bit on each side so a c-clip can be used to hold it in place, if it is not machined down, it will fit but there is no room for a c-clip. I know this because the same PO that put gear oil in my machine also rebuilt the tranny.

Oh and do a search for places to reline bands on the forum.

[thebuggyman1]

The bands should be fine later as long as they are fine now.
Transmission crafters will reline bands for $35 each. Here's a link with thier # http://www.6x6world.com/forums/trans...tml#post111255
You can buy a seal and gasket kit from R.I.....it will include new "c" clips. New bearings can be bought from Motion Industries...Except the OUTPUT bearings, they are special. Drew got that mixed up....sorry Drew
Buy a set of calipers and measure your bands, metal, then metal+band material...a little math will tell the thickness of band material that's left.

[amphibious drew]

The bands should be fine later as long as they are fine now.
Transmission crafters will reline bands for $35 each. Here's a link with thier # http://www.6x6world.com/forums/trans...tml#post111255
You can buy a seal and gasket kit from R.I.....it will include new "c" clips. New bearings can be bought from Motion Industries...Except the OUTPUT bearings, they are special. Drew got that mixed up....sorry Drew
Buy a set of calipers and measure your bands, metal, then metal+band material...a little math will tell the thickness of band material that's left.

Sorry long week. I think I even typed output and then switched it. Oh good Friday means extra sleep.

[photomd]

Thanks for y'all's help: much appreciated. I have a set of calipers. What thickness of material do I need (see below...I've measured mine)? I can't find a spec in the manual.

As for bearings, I'm confused. The manual states there are two sets of output bearings. These are the large ball bearings inserted from the outside of each case and held with a large c-clip, correct?

Thanks again...time to get some brake cleaner and get busy.

More updates: I have about 0.90mm to 1.1mm of material on all 4 bands. Any idea how much wear is OK?

[thebuggyman1]

I had 2 sets of bands out in the garage....an older set measured .057" (1.44mm) steel band .
A new set from recreatives measured .070" (1.77mm) steel band, and .115" (2.91mm) with lining.
I'd say that if your linig material was down to .020" (.51mm) or .025" (.63mm)....it's time to reline.

You are right on the ouput bearing except there are not 2 "sets".....just 2, one on each side. that bearing is a peer n6207......BUT, it has been ground down from 17mm thick to 15mm thick.

BTW...check your linings well to make sure the glue has not loosened.