Argo hoods

[curtisbyrne]

I think we can all agree that the older Argo models that were air colled always overheated and had to take the hoods off why didn't Argo do anything to fix he problem like add a fan to every Argo or just make the hoods better? Like really the hoods on the ht and htb models weren't to bad but on the the i/c models that was just as bad as having no hood entry at all? Why?

[george_pimpdaddy]

Yup on my 8x8 Magnum if its over 20C out ill run without the hood.

[eddieb1965]

I've always ran the hoods on all my Argo's,they have all had air inlet vent and the flywheel blower exit vent...

[curtisbyrne]

true but the 8 ic models it didnt make sense they knew it was going to get hot. same with the new avengers when they came out they had solid hoods why?

[philipatmaxfour]

true but the 8 ic models it didnt make sense they knew it was going to get hot. same with the new avengers when they came out they had solid hoods why?

I have never had an overheat problem with my older Avenger with the old style trans. Argo found out that they needed cooling help After they started installing the admiral trans. Maybe they were too slow coming up with the vented hood and maybe the hood fan should be standard?

[curtisbyrne]

Yes hood fan should be standard on all models

[JohnF]

I think we can all agree that the older Argo models that were air colled always overheated and had to take the hoods off

This is a veiled (as if it were opinion) claim. I disagree as I am skeptical of such a generalization. I would demand that you prove it in all conditions.

why didn't Argo do anything to fix he problem

A question! (I like that part) but then a claim that there is a problem and a claim that Argo did nothing, I am skeptical of your claims. Don't get too enamored with your train of thought here as I think you are wrong, to wit:

... Argo found out that they needed cooling help ... they ... coming up with the vented hood ...

To me, it sounds like when Argo identified a problem they acted to correct it.

... they knew it was going to get hot.

They did? Support that claim.

... same with the new avengers when they came out they had solid hoods why?

Because it wasn't a known problem :

I have never had an overheat problem with my older Avenger ...

Yes hood fan should be standard on all models

Why? I have never had a problem with my conquest. It would just be a wasted electrical load. I would get frustrated and wonder why Argo was making their machine more costly and complex than it needs to be.

I do hope that ragging on Argo has relieved your frustration a bit. There is some satisfaction in developing a clan-ship with others that share your frustration and finding a common enemy, but it is fake. Argo cannot succeed if they make crappy products. At the end of the day you will have to solve the problem you've discovered in the conditions you have.

You aren't ready to be an engineer grasshopper.

And I read your thread as rambling uneducated naive rhetoric, but then you started proselytizing. I don't know if I am in a generous or cantankerous mood this morning so take it either way.

[jpswift1]

You aren't ready to be an engineer grasshopper.

And I read your thread as rambling uneducated naive rhetoric.....

I hope your unnecessary ragging on other forum members and their opinions has made you feel better, even though it's certainly not needed nor is it what this site is about. Your post containing uneducated, negative jabs and assumptions about other forum members has no place here on 6X6World. If you want to do that, go post it on that other site that people rarely visit. Here's a tip for the future, don't take something so personally if somebody says something you don't like about an Argo and don't bother posting in your negative condescending matter because nobody here wants to hear it. Mike does a lot of work running such an excellent site with a positive atmosphere and he doesn't need to be wasting his time moderating childish behavior like that which you've displayed.

[curtisbyrne]

I wasn't rambling about anything Ina bad way I just wanted to know why they made solid hoods

[JohnF]

I hope your unnecessary ragging on other forum members and their opinions has made you feel better, even though it's certainly not needed nor is it what this site is about. Your post containing uneducated, negative jabs and assumptions about other forum members has no place here on 6X6World. If you want to do that, go post it on that other site that people rarely visit. Here's a tip for the future, don't take something so personally if somebody says something you don't like about an Argo and don't bother posting in your negative condescending matter because nobody here wants to hear it. Mike does a lot of work running such an excellent site with a positive atmosphere and he doesn't need to be wasting his time moderating childish behavior like that which you've displayed.

Cantankerous for you I see. Fair enough. In defense, I did make it a point to identify those things that were made as claims.

As to my comment, "And I read your thread as rambling uneducated naive rhetoric...", well, it's true. I see a lot of this on the internet and usually have no problem ignoring it. I rarely even get caught up in this sort of conversation any more. Most of the time the person isn't worth it.

But sometimes, sometimes, I think the person might come out ahead if somebody will just speak up and point out a thing or two. Keep in mind, when you make claims publicly you invite the public to debate the merits of your claims. It invites reason. It's a good thing and the "generous" aspect I was contemplating. It means I think someone is worth it.

My worry, you see, is that opinions expressed as claims that go unchallenged become truths. Time makes more converts than reason.

As to your claims:

... Your post containing uneducated, negative jabs and assumptions...

I do nothing of the sort.

...has no place here on 6X6World.

I disagree, reason and debate belong anywhere humans communicate to expand their and our knowledge.

I did not take it personal and it has nothing to do with the fact that I have an Argo.

... don't bother posting in your negative condescending matter ...

I'm assuming you mean "manner", anyway, it is not negative or condescending. It's frank and to the point.

[JohnF]

I wasn't rambling about anything Ina bad way I just wanted to know why they made solid hoods

For the same reason balloon tire/hollow axles/pinned axles/2 stroke engines/fiberglass tubs/... were used, because it was the technology that seemed to fit the requirements at the time.

You are in effect asking why engineers or designers make choices.

Anyway, I hope you can see my first post in the thread as being critical of what you have written and not critical of you. one view will make you defensive and close your mind and the other will open your mind and (hopefully) expand your knowledge.

Sometimes people can't see the difference.

[curtisbyrne]

Ok honestly I am sorry if I affected any one with this post . I was just simply asking the question why solid hoods I didn't think it was offensive I was just asking a question. Truly sorry
Curtis

[JohnF]

You have no reason to be sorry.

It was not offensive.

You used the word "affected" properly, (and I do notice these things ) so you are supporting my thesis but then this last post is trying to prove me wrong.

Please, do ask questions. In fact, question everything.

[ARGOJIM]

Well, there are a lot of pups at the pound. Some become Best Of Show and some become Junkyard dogs, some of this depends on how quick they learn new tricks and some on how badly they are scolded but they all need attention of some sort.


Curtis back to your question, please keep in mind I am neither an engineer nor an Argo employee.

Engine heat in an enclosed engine area has been an issue for virtually all powered vehicles since the onset, our vehicles are particularly vulnerable due to the enclosed hull.

What I've seen in Argo's, and this is an educated opinion only, is an ever developing change in air intake and exhaust outlet evolution for each model produced. Body designs are built and tested in varying environments and stresses to attain what is considered an acceptable under hood heat level.
For instance the Tecumseh style machine was originally designed with a 2 stroke and a flat hood, when the Tec. was introduced all Argo did was cut a hole in the hood for the valve cover and cover it in mesh, eventually the new scooped hood was added along with new air exit and intake holes through out the years finally ending up with a hood like your Magnum.
The KB models with the flat hood also had increasing amounts of air intake and exhaust air vents including being the only models with the vents on the face of the machine, the NKB too varied slightly with the air vents over the years and introduced the Hood on your Magnum that it eventually became. Also during this time frame the brake disc fan was introduced further dropping internal temps. and adding the cooling of the brake discs greatly needed in the 8 wheelers.
The Conquests are water cooled and introduced the large open side vent style similar to what is out now, no real overheating issue with these machines.
Twins and early Vanguards had the opposed twin and again changing air vents.
Vanguard to Bigfoots don't seem bad with heat, in all my years since 1999 with my machine I had one day I drove with the hood off due to 3 people, mountain terrain, 90 degrees. Bigfoots with brake fans must fare better. By the way this was only to aid in letting the air out faster do to a warm, ok hot, firewall, no deterrence in performance except when crawling and fuel lines getting warm. Again in my case 1 day.

I truly believe that most of the current heat issues began in the 2003-4 era when Argo started using internal/one piece mufflers.

I have driven a pre hood scoop Avenger HDI with the vents covered in mud and no brake fan and yes it got very warm in the engine compartment, but not the engine. The hood fan ( which sucks and not blows ) and brake fan probably would have cured this.
The Frontiers with the 23 B&S seem to be the biggest culprits in this series, the 23 does run warmer that the smaller engines, and most heat complaints that I've heard with any Frontier is over 90 degree outside air.


Again back to your original question the best answer I could give is, trial and error.

I do know there were heat issues prior to the introduction of the Kohler's in the Max II's.



p.s. It's dinner time and I did not proof read this.

[eddieb1965]

Woulda, Coulda, Shoulda, I have never had a heating issue that I had to take a hood off. I get enough leaves, sticks etc. thru the seating and rear compartment,I sure dont need anything in the engine compartment also. So I would say the engineers at that time said no louvers or holes in hood is needed. There are always side vents and exhaust vents,on every model that I know of.If you think you have enough of a heating issue then take your hood off and sell it,there are always people wanting replacements.....