Other than the 8x8 tank trainer...any other AATV use in military?

[Czechsix]

I'll also ask over at some other specialized forums, and sum up here, but have you guys seen any other uses of AATV's in the military? Other than recreation? Most of my books are packed away, so I can't get to my U.S. military vehicle history books, but I seem to remember there were a few prototypes and test vehicles...but nothing in actual use, other than the 8x8.

My other interest and hobby is historic military vehicles, it'd be great to be able to tie these two hobbies together....

[Noel Woods]

The Brits and other commonwealth troops use the Supacat. The U.S. used the Gamma Goat years ago. The M113 and the Bradley Cavalry vehicle were amphibious as well. The Russkies have a wide variety of wheeled and tracked amphib machines.

In terms of smaller machines, I think you are correct that the Attex tank trainers were the only recreational amphibs pressed into military service (of sorts).

[Mike]

Also include the KID 8x8 that was designed for the US to use in Vietnam. Although they never officially got a government contract several hundred were still made and perhaps a few actually used in Vietnam.

Land Tamer has developed a couple of different machines (some autonomous) for the military as well.

[George]

http://www.vintagemilitarytrucks.com/M561_Gama_Goat_Page.htm

The Gama Goat was just like a huge Sur-Trek. It did swim but not very well.

[jpswift1]

Hustler made a military use AATV too. Here's a picture of it in the background behind the Attex 8x8. Also, if you look at this Hustler brochure (in the left hand green margin, the third paragraph up from the bottom) you'll see that Hustler mentions that their AATV was selected as a combat vehicle simulator for the US Army.

http://www.6x6world.com/images/brochures/Hustler-3.jpg

[Czechsix]

Hustler made a military use AATV too. Here's a picture of it in the background behind the Attex 8x8. Also, if you look at this Hustler brochure (in the left hand green margin, the third paragraph up from the bottom) you'll see that Hustler mentions that their AATV was selected as a combat vehicle simulator for the US Army.

http://www.6x6world.com/images/brochures/Hustler-3.jpg

Good eyes! I completely missed that background 6x6!

Enlarging it a bit, I see that it has a hoop style roll cage, probably a radio and antenna mount, and no body band that I can see. Does anyone have any more info on this 6x6? Pics, brochures, etc? Where'd the original pic come from. I do know of one guy that would have known about this...but sadly, he's passed on, and the info with him.

Also, to specify, I was thinking more of the civilian versions pressed into military service - not so much the Gama Goats, TerraStar, Mehli, etc. I do know, and have some pics around here, that the Coot, and the Trackster were also tested and possibly used in field trials.

[Noel Woods]

The M48 and later M60 series U.S. tanks, as well as the M114, and M113 all steered with sticks. Same set up as Hustler, Max, Attex, etc., I went into the Army in 1987 and was amazed that I already had years of tank experience under my belt by growing up with amphibs. Obviously the M60s were much larger vehicles. The Bradleys and M1 series had a set up similar to what Argo uses with the yoke/steering system.

[Czechsix]

Here's a page on the Jiger, as tested by the U.S. Army.

History - US Army Jiger

[jpswift1]

That's right, I forgot about the Jiger and the US Army. I really wish I had more info on the Hustler combat vehicle simulator, but I don't. I'm quite the Hustler nut myself and would love to hear about it if it were possible to dig it up.

[Czechsix]

I'll see if I can dig something up. Whatever I find, I'll post.

You never, ever know what'll turn up out in the world. Case in point: I've been interested for many years in the tristar wheel concept, used to visit the old Landmaster every so often when it was still in southern california. I remember reading about a few testbed vehicles put out by Lockheed, and they were actually thinking about marketing them as recreational vehicles. Was going to be called the "TerraStar". All I ever saw on them were photos...at least until....

There's a large historic military vehicle meet in California called the Tower Park Meet. Lots of us nuts show up there, with all sorts of interesting things. It was the end of the meet, and I was sitting down with a few friends and a beer or two, watching the park empty, and saying good bye till next year to buddies that were driving out. Then I spotted a truck and trailer driving in, with a faded yellow vehicle on the back, about the size of a VW. I took one look at it, whooped, and ran over while he was driving in. I followed him until he parked, and talked to the driver. It was an 18 year old - him and his dad had just finished restoring a mule that they brought to the meet, and when they were showing it, a local farmer showed up and asked if they might be interested in trading it for something else he had in his barn. Seems the farmer bought this vehicle years back at a government auction, ran it a bit, it broke down and was parked for years. To make a long story short, the kid went out with the mule, and swapped right there for the TerraStar. As far as I know, only three of them were built. I took lots of photos, it was in very complete condition. Had a VW engine for a power plant, I'd have to dig up the pics for any more info. Can't remember if it had a t20 in it, but it was a skid steer, chain drive, amphibious atv. I never thought I'd ever see something like that...but I did. Unfortunately, I could never contact the kid about it - tried calling, phone was disconnected, etc. I'd love to buy that thing, but seeing it, and how it was built, it wouldn't be too hard to recreate it, even in a garage.

I've got a thread going over in one of the major military vehicle forums, I'll cross post whatever I find out.

Neat stuff!

[jpswift1]

I'll see if I can dig something up. Whatever I find, I'll post.

You never, ever know what'll turn up out in the world. Case in point: I've been interested for many years in the tristar wheel concept, used to visit the old Landmaster every so often when it was still in southern california. I remember reading about a few testbed vehicles put out by Lockheed, and they were actually thinking about marketing them as recreational vehicles. Was going to be called the "TerraStar". All I ever saw on them were photos...at least until....

There's a large historic military vehicle meet in California called the Tower Park Meet. Lots of us nuts show up there, with all sorts of interesting things. It was the end of the meet, and I was sitting down with a few friends and a beer or two, watching the park empty, and saying good bye till next year to buddies that were driving out. Then I spotted a truck and trailer driving in, with a faded yellow vehicle on the back, about the size of a VW. I took one look at it, whooped, and ran over while he was driving in. I followed him until he parked, and talked to the driver. It was an 18 year old - him and his dad had just finished restoring a mule that they brought to the meet, and when they were showing it, a local farmer showed up and asked if they might be interested in trading it for something else he had in his barn. Seems the farmer bought this vehicle years back at a government auction, ran it a bit, it broke down and was parked for years. To make a long story short, the kid went out with the mule, and swapped right there for the TerraStar. As far as I know, only three of them were built. I took lots of photos, it was in very complete condition. Had a VW engine for a power plant, I'd have to dig up the pics for any more info. Can't remember if it had a t20 in it, but it was a skid steer, chain drive, amphibious atv. I never thought I'd ever see something like that...but I did. Unfortunately, I could never contact the kid about it - tried calling, phone was disconnected, etc. I'd love to buy that thing, but seeing it, and how it was built, it wouldn't be too hard to recreate it, even in a garage.

I've got a thread going over in one of the major military vehicle forums, I'll cross post whatever I find out.

Neat stuff!

Very cool! Keep us updated for sure.

[techfx]

I remembered and just Googled/found this article about Max in Afganistan, 2002, Buffalo News:



ZoomInfo Cached Page


By MATT GLYNN
News Business Reporter
3/4/2002


Somewhere in Afghanistan, U.S. Special Forces soldiers are riding around on all-terrain vehicles made by a Buffalo company. Recreatives Industries isn't exactly sure how the military is using the 10 ATVs it supplied. Much of what the Special Forces units are doing in Operation Enduring Freedom is veiled in secrecy.
The soldiers are using the six-wheeled vehicles every day. They refer to the company's ATV as "the bus," since it can carry four people, unlike other ATVs that hold only one or two people. No complaints have filtered back to the makers of the vehicles. "The only feedback I've gotten so far is the vehicles are working out quite nicely," said Galen Reich, Recreatives Industries' marketing manager.
News reports have mentioned Special Forces soldiers using ATVs to cross the rugged terrain, including in the mountainous Tora Bora region, where the Army was hunting Osama bin Laden and trying to root out al-Qaeda forces.
The U.S. military found Recreatives Industries through the company's Web site. It bought seven of the ATVs - called the MAX IV - in brown, and three in camouflage colors. The vehicles were shipped to Kentucky, where defense contractor Raytheon made unspecified additions. Then they were flown overseas.
Recreatives Industries' ATVs are popular with hunters and fishermen, who like the vehicles' durability and the fact that they're amphibious, said Jari Wallach, Recreatives Industries' president. The company has been around for more than 30 years and employs about 25 people, selling roughly 1,000 ATVs a year.
The MAX IV can travel up to 25 miles per hour, and can negotiate rugged terrain and narrow passes where trucks or Humvees might have problems. Since they're small, the ATVs can also move around without attracting much attention.
The company's military contact, who asked that his name and command not be identified, said U.S. soldiers give the MAX IV the thumbs-up.
"The guys have been very pleased with the performance of the products they have received," he said.
"We didn't buy an extremely large quantity because we looked at what they had as fulfilling a special requirement that no one else could fill," the military source said. He was referring to the fact that the MAX IV could easily carry four people, as well as tow a trailer.
No one else made an ATV with the size and weight dimensions the military was looking for, he said. The military has also bought ATVs made by Polaris for use in Operation Enduring Freedom.
The field next to Recreatives Industries on Depot Street is a long way from the tough, dangerous terrain of Afghanistan. But Reich, the marketing manager, drove one of the ATVs over an informal test track on the company property to demonstrate why the government was interested.
Reich chose the path of greatest resistance, climbing over snowbanks and speeding over rocks and chunks of concrete, without getting stuck on any of the obstacles. When tall, thick weeds loomed above the front of the ATV, Reich didn't hesitate. He rolled onward, crushing the weeds beneath the six tires.
The military bought the 10 ATVs for about $10,000 each. It also bought $10,000 worth of parts to keep the vehicles in good working condition. The military contact described the parts package this way: "You're going to run the Baja 5000 by yourself, what do you want?"
Meanwhile, company employees have been trying to catch a glimpse of its ATVs in action overseas in footage on CNN or in pictures on the Internet. They're also hopeful that its ATVs' performance in Afghanistan will lead to more orders from Uncle Sam.
The military contact said he expects more will be ordered, particularly since the war against terrorism is likely to reach other parts of the globe.
"It will take on an expanded role as time goes on," he said.

[jpswift1]

That's right! I forgot about the Max version. I remember seeing a couple pictures of these. They were based on a Max IV and they had a steel upper body, and it didn't looks like the Max IV top at all. Very cool though. I'll see if I can dig up a picture.

[Noel Woods]

Very interesting story. I know the Russians had utilized their BTR60s, and BMP1 and BMP2s with great success in Afghanistan (even though they lost the war). I would sure like to see a photo of those metal Max4 machines. Hopefully Jeff can scrape them up.

[fmints]

The Bradleys and M1 series had a set up similar to what Argo uses with the yoke/steering system.

Abrams and Bradleys are fun!!