Bought a Lemon . . . Need Some Advice

[Rolling_X_6]

Go for It . . . I Think It Would Be Useful!!!

Last month a idea came to my head to start a "How to or What to look for Thread" All members who have machines will put in information into this thread. Members and non-member upon reading this will have a more educated idea of what to look for in a used machine. I really hate to hear when someone gets taken to the cleaners, we want people to enjoy their machines and their experience with the AATV world. Not become frustrated and give up.

Thoughts on this? You guys tell me. Would anyone feel that people would use it? This may prevent people from paying to much for a poorly kept machine. Members on this site are Super knowledgeable of the different types of machines and may save a member or potential member a lot of money when buying a machine.

I'm not trying to hijack this thread, i thought this would be a pretty good place to throw this out for opinions.

Lewis

No problem, Lewis. Use this thread for whatever . . .

I do think it would help to have an obviously titled thread with BOTH everyone's advice about what to look for / what to keep in mind when considering to buy a used machine . . . AND perhaps even forum members' good and/or "not so good" experiences with their first used AATV purchases.

I am a public school teacher in central Pennsylvania, and I tell my students that mistakes are not a bad thing as long as you and/or someone else can learn from them. So, even shared bad experiences can be helpful to those who are looking to buy a used AATV.

Good idea, Lewis.

[Robinhood02]

maybe you would like to sell it and try ebay again ,i may be interested in taking it off your hands

[Rolling_X_6]

Hello--

I have a small paintball business . . . it is really more of a ministry than a business. I do it as a youth out-reach, but anyhow . . . my point is that I am somewhat into paintballing. I have been doing it for about 8 1/2 years with groups of students and parents . . . as well as with other youth groups.

As a result, I am a member of a paintballing forum, as well. I do not get on it very often. It has it purpose. But, the advice is not always that sound, and the quality of conversation and such is not that great . . . but then again, it should not be surprising. No offense or anything, but the average age of the members is probably 15 years old or so. I mean, how great was your advice and how mature was your conversation when you were 15, you know???

I only mention that other forum to make this point . . . this forum is a wonderful asset to anyone interested in this topic: AATV's.

You folks are a great bunch of people who not only offer a lot of sound and meaningful advice . . . but who also are great at encouraging and inspiring their fellow forum members to quit complaining about mechanical problems and, instead, pick up that wrench and fix what needs fixin'.

Thanks folks.

Update on the Project:

This afternoon, my dad, my brother, and I worked at getting those two broken off bolts out of the T-20. Neither one would come out with an easy-out. The one we ended up sort cutting into pieces by drilling a bunch of holes into it and then pulling the little pieces out. We still ended up drilling the hole out over-sized and tapping it out for a 1/2 in. bolt. No biggie. It will be fine.

The other bolt--while we were trying to drill the bolt into smaller pieces--we drilled out through the bolt hole forged into the T-20 housing right into the oil chamber of the T-20!!!

Wow!!! I SURE am taking a beating with this machine!!!

So, after we did the same thing to this hole as the first (drilled and tapped it out for a 1/2 bolt) we put some red, silicone form-a-gasket stuff into the little side hole to seal it off so the oil cannot pour out. We are now letting it sit over night to set up.

Oh well . . . such it life. Once we have it back together, it will be fine. Once it is all back together with a bolt in the hole, I do not think it will be able to leak. In fact, I think I will put some more of that red silicone stuff on the actual bolt when I re-install the T-20 back into my Max. It will be fine.

Later.

[lewis]

Great attitude!!!!

Bully Good for you!!!!! The machine will come together just takes time.

Rolling, that is great!!!!!! Give kids some outlet for that energy instead of street gangs and drugs. I take my hat off to you, keep up the great work with the children, they are the future and you are making a great investment!

Love paint ball. Started playing back in the early 90's late 80's. That stuff is a blast. Haven't played this year but i still have all my gear. It was a father son thing and my youngest son he hooked me on it. We had the real paint grenades and mortars. The weapons were pump single shot at the time. I have a Bob Long GZ with warp feeder for speed ball, AutoCockers, Tipmans with long barrels, pistols for close in work. We would set booby-traps, and all. Still carrying a few scars but they were fun getting. Those weapons were hot(over 385 fps) Adults go figure. I miss it now that i am a little older, hitting the ground is a little harder to get up.. Found a new gentler sport AATV racing and what a rush that is.

[Robinhood02]

don't forget to "Red Loctite" those 4 bolts into place when you install the trani and use good grade 8 bolts so that IF you have to remove the trani agian in the future they won't break again (i use stainless steel they dont rust either)

also if you are new to the Max, I believe the trani takes 28 oz of Type 'F" transmission fluid plus about 4 oz of limited slip gear oil as friction modifier ,someone here may be able to confirm that.

[Robinhood02]

PS why do we use Type "F" and then add friction modifiers ,,,when Dexron VI already is a tranifluid with friction modifiers in it ??? is this one of those things that are done the old way just because it's always been done that way or is it that RI doesn't know about Dexron VI ???????????

[Rolling_X_6]

Robinhood02, thanks for your advice, as well. Everyone has been great.

These bolts actually broke while in the Max--apparently during operation at some point--they did not twist off during the removal of the T-20, just to clarify. Maybe you already did understand that. I just wanted to throw that out there in case I had not explained myself very well.

I say all of that to ask, though . . . what would be the grade / type of bolt that would be least likely to shear off like that again in the future???

Now, I will probably have less problems with that in the future for a couple of reason: 1. Those bolts may have sheared off because of all of the other dis-repair of the machine, which I am in the process of fixing. 2. As stated earlier, I was forced to tap those two holes out to 1/2 in. bolts now, instead of the original 3/8 in. bolts. So, right there I will gain strength. 3. Plus, I bought some other mounting enhancements from Recreatives that I will be welding in place to help improve the T-20's mounting strength.

But, even with that said, I am still curious which bolt grade / type you folks think would be least likely to shear in the future. I think there has been some debate as to whether the grade 8 bolts are too "hard," therefore brittle . . . yet, I always thought they were simply the strongest bolts, period. I am pretty sure that Recreatives use grade 5. I do know that that is what they use for SOME of the stuff; I asked them. And, I think it was in direct reference to those T-20 mounting bolts when I talked to them about that . . . among other things, too.

Thanks.

[lewis]

Grade 5's will be fine, bolts are designed for tinsel strength. They will shear at a much lower point with side force and that is what has happened to the studs in the T-20.

Here is a chart of bolt strength and material. This is a very good little reference.

Bolt Depot - Bolt Grade Markings and Strength Chart

[Robinhood02]

if you gotta drive to the bolt shop and get bolts for the job ,grade 5 will work but the extra cost to upgrade to grade 8 is meaningless ,it is imperitive in this case that you get the right length of bolt as well ,too long and they bottom out ,too short and they don't grab enough aluminum case to hold properly, i speak from expirience on this including the red loctite LOL

[Roger S]

there are all kinds of "friction modifiers" in ATF fluids, many more today than in the past. Thats basically the difference in all the current fluids. So type F plus a GM limited slip additive isn't = to any dexron. People have preferences, just find something you like.