Help my Mudd-Ox sunk!

[smokeeter]

Thanks for the advice. I tried pushing the levers forward, but it didn't work. The tires aren't turning. I found the link on the other chain attached to the motor. I'll have to take off the chain and hope that the tires spin.

With the levers forward the wheels will not rotate freely as a neutral setting but they will rotate, you will need another vehicle or winch to move it and won't be able to push it by hand because of the weight of the machine and resistance of the hydraulic motors. With the levers in the center or neutral position the wheels will be locked.
I had to move my ox when I had a stripped coupler and I experienced this first hand,I broke the winch cable trying it with the levers in the center and with directions from Matt he advised me to hold the levers forward and I was able to tow the machine forward and load it onto my trailer. There aren't any bypass valves on my unit,but I don't know if the newest versions have any installed ( I doubt they do ,although they would be a good feature but added expense).

[mudbug3]

When I owned 2010 Mudd-Ox I did'nt see any bypass valves on the wheel motors. I was told that my Mudd-Ox had some ,but I could'nt see any.

[Bazooo guy]

The pressure relief could be internal and preset with no adjustment.
Pushing the sticks forward opens the valves but it wont roll easy.

[kmac]

Thanks for all the suggestions. The hand brakes were clamped on so i had to release them first. I went for the chain link after and got them off. But they doubled back on themselves so more problems. We managed to free the wheels so all is well. We drew a curious crowd; not the kind of stuff i wanted. I wish I was told all of this (about the ox taking on water easy) because i opted for an argo, but i really wanted a diesel and was afraid of the chains . We had the safari rack, the aluminium cab and a 9.9 hp yamaha outboard motor, plus two full sized males (6' and 6'2"). I think it just could not handle the weight. It was a clam day, no crazy water entry angles, we just drove into the sea from the beach and the ox just pitched left and started taking on water. Before we knew it, it was underwater and i was in the cab. Had swim out. Again Mattsaid it was unstable in the water and he said he was making a wider body for it to float much better. He said that he completed it. So i guess he didn't do squat if on its maiden voyage the ox was like titanic.

I need to find out what to do now, seeing that the ox was completely submerged. Is there any hope for the engine or the electronics?

[Buzz]

gotta-balance-the-load

Man, that's horrible news. I hate hearing that. I'll question going in the water with an aluminum cab (top-heavy) mounted in the front plus two big guys sitting in the front as well as additional weight in the machine- plus a diesel. Additional options take away payload. A true water rig in the argo/mudd-ox body size needs to be kept as light as possible. Having wheel-spacers and/or longer bearing cages/axles to put the tires out wider help a lot with stability. Riding in the back (w/kicker)would have been a much better option. 1st time I floated my gas machine (2010) 15" rubber tracks,brushguard, skid-plate, canvas top- I did it empty to get an idea how it was balanced. I've towed it with a boat for a steady 30 minutes(into-wind+against-current) and even though I was concerned that the front of the machine was going to "plow" a bit, I didn't take on any water. I've made the same trip "with" the wind while riding in the back of the machine operating the kicker and found it to be very stable. An unbalanced,heavy load in that size tub is asking for trouble. My machines 1-gas, 1-diesel have placards on the dash stating payload-minus-accessories. The newest frame in the diesel is over 100 lbs lighter and stronger which helps. My old avenger with those options would not faired
much better in the water. I'm not trying to kick a brother when he's down but it seems like there's more to the story. I'm just a casual observer, but it doesn't seem right to place all the blame on someone else. I've had great capability on the water with an ox that's set up correctly. I really am sorry to hear about your bad luck, it makes me sick.

[Matt O.]

Man, that's horrible news. I hate hearing that. I'll question going in the water with an aluminum cab (top-heavy) mounted in the front plus two big guys sitting in the front as well as additional weight in the machine- plus a diesel. Additional options take away payload. A true water rig in the argo/mudd-ox body size needs to be kept as light as possible. Having wheel-spacers and/or longer bearing cages/axles to put the tires out wider help a lot with stability. Riding in the back (w/kicker)would have been a much better option. 1st time I floated my gas machine (2010) 15" rubber tracks,brushguard, skid-plate, canvas top- I did it empty to get an idea how it was balanced. I've towed it with a boat for a steady 30 minutes(into-wind+against-current) and even though I was concerned that the front of the machine was going to "plow" a bit, I didn't take on any water. I've made the same trip "with" the wind while riding in the back of the machine operating the kicker and found it to be very stable. An unbalanced,heavy load in that size tub is asking for trouble. My machines 1-gas, 1-diesel have placards on the dash stating payload-minus-accessories. The newest frame in the diesel is over 100 lbs lighter and stronger which helps. My old avenger with those options would not faired
much better in the water. I'm not trying to kick a brother when he's down but it seems like there's more to the story. I'm just a casual observer, but it doesn't seem right to place all the blame on someone else. I've had great capability on the water with an ox that's set up correctly. I really am sorry to hear about your bad luck, it makes me sick.

Hi Kurt,
I just found this thread. I will give you a call right now to help you get your Mudd-Ox up and going again. Buzz is correct. You have to balance the load. passangers and cargo. I have made changes to the machine to lighten it up and make it float better and your machines have this done. To tow the Mudd-Ox direct drive machines ( No Clutch) mid 2010 and latter Gas or Diesel There are 4 relief valves on the hydro pump. Two on the top and two on the bottom. They are in the center of the pump and are about 1" round and take a allen wrench to turn them. You will turn each one counter clockwise about 2 turns. This will allow you to tow your machine and leave the chains on.

Matt

[kmac]

Buzz,
That's fine I'll take all the suggestions. I was naive, but i just thought it was tested and was fine and that it was fitted with a wider body so that it would float better. I went in the water confident that it would float and handle the water better. I wasn't reckless or anything. I just drove up to the water expecting it to float and it didn't. But now i know that these machines are land-lovers that can go on the water if needed and not really a 50-50 machine (50% land and 50% water) which is what i really needed. Also I hope that i'm not scandalising matt but my experience to date hasn't been great, and this is just the icing on the cake. I'm just glad that it wasn't shipped with all the fancy fan dangles because I would be screwed and i am glad it happened now so that i can know the limitations of these machines. I'm going to ditch the aluminium top for sure and possibly the rack and see what happens...but in the mean time i need to check the engine if it was flooded and to determine if there are any problems. I also need to drain the fuel tank. So i would welcome any suggestions on how to get the ox back up and running...

[kmac]

Matt,
I don't have my phone, it was swamped and the sim isn't working. I went for the chain and that worked. Also i understand the need for balance but it was just two of us with a jerry can of fuel. One person at the front and one person at the back. So unless it can only handle one person, i think it was balance was ok as far as we could determine. I will send an email to you with a number that you can reach me on.

[Noel Woods]

I always hate to hear of a swamped machine. Lesson learned for anyone reading this thread: start light when going in the water. Experiment with load as your skill with your machine increases.

I hope Matt O can assist you in getting the machine back in good order. Please keep us updated on status, and good luck with getting the machine going again.

[mrtlc]

HI Matt and Kurt
It sound like this machine may need a set of small pontoons for stability and the area Kurt want to use it in.

[mudbug3]

Kmac

If the motor was running when the tub turned over in the water , check the oil to see if it has any water showing on the oil dip stick. Is you see any water mixed with oil on the dip stick I'd drain out all of the engine oil two -- three times or until you no longer see any indication of water on the oil dip stick. Also check to see if you got any water in the air cleaner element.

[kmac]

Noel,
I think the only way i could have gone in any lighter was to ditch the aluminium cab and the rack. We had no other weight except a jerry can with fuel and the outboard motor fuel, and someone at the back. But it is a lesson learnt. I will definitely ditch the aluminium cab and take off the rack. I will test the second atv first without the outboard motor and then with the outboard motor and see how it gets on. We usually use the sea to access the river, but some of the swells and waves that our 14ft jon boat has stood up to, i am not sure the ox will stand up to. But I'll see how it goes. Unfortunately they guys (my field staff) don't have any faith or hope that they can eventually meet our needs.

@mrtic..to be fair to matt, he suggested adding something similar to a pontoon as an additional floating aid, but i didn't want a unit with these cumbersome features because i had intended to do a fair amount of driving in tight spaces.

[azz7772]

hi if your project that you are doing can allow you to afford two mud-oxes. I would get one of those boats that are designed like a landing craft where the front opens like a drive on ramp, and use that to ferry the mud-oxes and gear through the sea part and drop them off in the river system where applicable then you have a safe fast way to get out in case of emergency.
can maybe make a cheap one out of an old pontoon boat.

[Matt O.]

100_7239.jpg100_7237.jpg100_7238.jpgHi,
I have talked to Kurt and we are working on getting his machine up and running. He will be adding the float kit. The front float adds 350 pounds of floatation.

Matt

[Noel Woods]

[QUOTE=Matt O.;118116]100_7239.jpg100_7237.jpg100_7238.jpgHi,
I have talked to Kurt and we are working on getting his machine up and running. He will be adding the float kit. The front float adds 350 pounds of floatation.

That's great to have the manufacturers support behind you, especially with a new machine(s).
Kurt, please keep us posted on the progress.