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  • Newt the Bold project

    I thought that I had started a thread on this build a while ago, but I can'tseem to find it anywhere. The SUNY system fails me once again....

    So, with as many other projects that have landed in my garage, I picked up abeautiful blue Newt the Bold project that once belonged to JP. The Newt's a unique piece. I think what hits you first about the machine is it's size.



    The volume of the lower and upper tub is comparable to an Argo 8x8, squished, squozen and squeedazzled into a big fat six wheeler. Originally, Newt was a fiberglass body with a central "spine" that held the transmission and engine cradle, along with the inboard bearings on the center and rear axles. All six outer bearings were simply bolted to the fiberglass, along with thefront inner bearing flanges. Overall, the fiberglass body itself isn't that heavy (probably about 80 pounds or so for the lower body and 50-60 pounds for the upper), and the structure is a bit thin compared to other machines that were similarly constructed (Scrambler and SPD Wedge come to mind). Over its lifetime of use, this resulted in an extreme case of blowedouttedness on the body around two of the right side axles.



    This girl needs a frame. Like, whoa. So, here's a frame...



    The frame rails are made out of 3/16" plate, with two 1-1/2" tube crossmembers connecting it together. There's going to be a second tubular frame right between the upper and lower bodies which, will incorporate a winch moun ton the front and other supports connecting it down to the primary frame. (lots more to be added to the above picture...)

    The engine is a Kubota V1505 4-cylinder, advertised at about 38hp, depending on which specifications you quote. I've got gobs and gobs of room in this thing, which will allow me to squeeze in hundreds and hundreds of pounds of driveline components. The V1505 comes in at about 250 pounds itself (dry, no radiator or other components). With all this room, and a completely blank slate I really wanted to go crazy and try to fit in a low range gear box ahead (in driveline order, not physically) of the T-20 transmission (scoff if you must, naysayers….). Through the extreme generosity of MaxIV Mark, I picked up an NP203 transfer case out of a 70s vintage Dodge. The NP203 has the distinction of having a gear-driven hi/lo range box ahead of a somewhat maligned chain-driven transfer case. The gearbox itself is really a high strength unit, and outside of the hulking Kubota behind it, it should be about the toughest component in the machine (fingers crossed). I think it weighs about 90 pounds in total, based on how many ibuprofen I took the morning after 58 consecutive installs and extractions on the mockup.



    In the original configuration, the 203 range box has a female front input, and a long output shaft. My plan is to adapt a standard T-20 driven clutch to the input, and drive the T-20 with double #60 chain off the output shaft. The rangebox has a reduction of about 2:1 in low, and 1:1 in high. This is going to give me a lot of options as far as final sprocket size on the axles and the T-20. (I’d like to drive the axles with #60 off theT-20). It’ll also let me pull a three-bottom plow should the need arise.

    At the end of the day, the blue fiberglass is basically nothing more than a really cool-looking wrapper for what I hope is another cool machine. Lots and lots of time is spent thinking how things need to be layed out, saving a little cash for the next round of parts and fabricating parts when I have the time. The Super Swamp Fox was basically the same setup, but that already had a frame that I simply duplicated and upgraded a bit. Oh, and it needed zero bodywork… It seems to work well, so hopefully the timeinvested in this project will yield the same results….

    Watch this space…..
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  • #2
    Thanks posting this Mike. This is going to be a incredible machine, a couple quick questions.

    How are going to connect the output of the 203 to the T-20 input shaft? Trying to visualize it but i'm having difficulty. Also I assume it would still work in reverse (like a 4wd). What about a split shift? I don't see any reason that couldn't work but maybe it would be just too much linkage and levers.

    Mike
    "Don't worry my Dad's a TV repairman, he has an excellent set of tools..I can fix It"

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    • #3
      Originally posted by micmac View Post
      ....but maybe it would be just too much linkage and levers.
      IS there such a thing?!

      Thanks for the comment, Mike... I hope it all works. As I described in one of the pictures in the gallery, I'm planning on driving the T-20 from the right hand ("passenger's") side of the machine. T-20s don't really care which side you drive them from, and since the rotation is going to be the same I can just put the input shaft there; I'll just swap the output collars from the left to the right side when I build the tranny. What I'd like to do, is have a double 60 (maybe double 50, still thinking...) sprocket on the 203 output and the T-20 input, joined with a (obviously) double 50 or 60 chain. I'm picturing all the force of a (quickly approaching) 1200 pound machine lumbering out of a mud hole with all the force focused on that chain, in low range. The 1505 makes decent torque, and that's going to amplifed through that low range box.

      When you say "I assumed it would work in reverse", do you mean the range box, or driving the T-20 from the opposite-from-conventional side? I'm still using the range box input/output in the correct sequence, otherwise it would be a 2:1 overdrive (which some crazy people have tried in the truck world...)

      I'll probably do a split shift, too. I really doubt I'd ever use it, but the beauty of the split shift is that you're not "forced" to use it. It's there if you ever need it, if only the need ever arises once. I've got a pretty simple idea for the hi/lo shift linkage, and the T-20 is going to be so far forward, i think I could almost duplicate what I did for the Swamp Fox. Maybe like this?



      I had a friend that had an NP203 box ahead of an NP205 in a Bronco. He had a lever for the range box, a lever for the front differential engage, disengage, a lever for the rear differential, a lever for the PTO on the 205, and then the gear shift. When stuff got hairy, you had to make sure all five of them were clearly labeled.
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      • #4
        How's the hi/low range gearbox look inside? Chocolate milk? I'm assuming since you've got it in the machine for a mockup, it's most likely going to be usable.

        I remember there was some kid that was on the site that was briefly on the site that was "claiming" that his Suzuki 4 wheeler with hi/low range would pull any 6 wheeler backwards. I'd like to see him hook back to back with your Newt The Boldozer.
        "Looks like you have a problem with your 4 wheeler........you're missin' two wheels there"
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        • #5
          Originally posted by jpswift1 View Post
          How's the hi/low range gearbox look inside? Chocolate milk?
          No, thank goodness! The oil seal on the front input saved it from getting filled up with water, I guess. I tore it down last night and was pleased that there was minimal oxidation on a few of the gears. A spray down with WD-40 and it basically wiped off. Most of it was from condensation, I guess. I'll end up tearing the whole thing apart and blasting off the case before a fresh oil-fill regardless.


          Originally posted by jpswift1 View Post
          I remember there was some kid that was on the site that was briefly on the site that was "claiming" that his Suzuki 4 wheeler with hi/low range would pull any 6 wheeler backwards. I'd like to see him hook back to back with your Newt The Boldozer.
          As long as it's not THIS four-wheel 'Zook, I'll give it a whirl.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by hydromike View Post
            No, thank goodness! The oil seal on the front input saved it from getting filled up with water, I guess. I tore it down last night and was pleased that there was minimal oxidation on a few of the gears. A spray down with WD-40 and it basically wiped off. Most of it was from condensation, I guess. I'll end up tearing the whole thing apart and blasting off the case before a fresh oil-fill regardless.

            Good to hear that! Are you going to end up using the tail from the 727 and turn it down to accept the driven clutch?


            As long as it's not THIS four-wheel 'Zook, I'll give it a whirl.

            Nope, it wasn't a Samurai. It was some old Suzuki LT 250 4x4. The screeching and popping of cheap Japanese cast aluminum snapping apart would have a nice ring to it as it's being towed backwards behind Newt.

            "Looks like you have a problem with your 4 wheeler........you're missin' two wheels there"
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            • #7
              Hey Mike, I want to throw in an alternative to the 203 xfer case......WHAT IF: You replaced the 203 with a straight shaft, well supported by pillow blocks. Put a secondary on one side to match up with the motor. On the other side put a primary clutch, and a secondary on the t-20. Yes, 2 pair of clutches. Coordinate the primary/secondary pairs to have one advance faster than the other (I'd keep shaft speed lower). You could still get the effect of the low gearing, without having to shift. I would also shim the second primary clutch so it engages the belt all the time. And you could add a rotor and caliper to the shaft if you wanted to help with t-20 shifting......HMMMM I'm thinking new project for buggyman

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              • #8
                Originally posted by thebuggyman1 View Post
                HMMMM I'm thinking new project for buggyman
                Holy crap, dude. I'm going to keep it simple and just run the big 'ol piece of cast iron. I bet your idea would work with a lot of thought and tuning, but I don't want to go down that road. I'm actually looking forward to the whole idea of "shifting into low". The 203 has a very satisfying detent between H-N-L.

                You can't tell me this is the very first time you've thought of this project....
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                • #9
                  Originally posted by hydromike View Post
                  You can't tell me this is the very first time you've thought of this project....
                  Actually it is. I never really thought about low gear due to the limited space in any of my previous projects.

                  So, now comes my next thought.......ASHTABULA! With that kind of reduction......you could go to TALL gears for the straight aways. And it wouldn't add much weight.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by thebuggyman1 View Post
                    So, now comes my next thought.......ASHTABULA!
                    Put-down-the-crack-pipe.
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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by hydromike View Post
                      Put-down-the-crack-pipe and come help me get it ready for Ashtabula.


                      Mike, I've been enjoying the pictures and I'm glad you put together a thread for the blue beast. I'm digging the transfer case. That should give you plenty of options for speed/torque.

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                      • #12
                        I saw Newt pop up in the random photo filmstrip on the main forum page and couldn't stop thinking that it needs a Rolls Royce Grill.

                        Newt the Rolls?
                        NewttheRolls.jpg

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Mike View Post
                          I saw Newt pop up in the random photo filmstrip on the main forum page and couldn't stop thinking that it needs a Rolls Royce Grill.

                          Newt the Rolls?
                          [ATTACH=CONFIG]9952[/ATTACH]
                          I thought that many times while starring at it as it rested in my backyard. I would think a lincon would work too and may be easier on the budget
                          l like to buy stuff and no I don't do payments!

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                          • #14
                            Oh baby, that's blingtastic!

                            I still have no idea what I'm going to do with the front end of this hulking piece, but I've already added braces on the tube frame for a winch. I just don't know!
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                            • #15
                              I wish things could go faster on this project, but half of what I do seems to be thinking about how to do this from scratch the right way the first time.This thing is starting to make the Swamp Fox look like an easy clean-up-and-ride project.

                              Over the past couple-few weeks, I've been accumulating a bunch of different parts to try to get the engine, the range box and the transmission in some sort of final alignment. I bought two double #50 hardened sprockets (a 15 tooth for the range box, and a 12 tooth for the T-20) and spent some time in front of the lathe get them both up to the right bore size. I had to make an input shaft forthe NP203 range box that would accommodate the 7/8" driven clutch, which turned out pretty nice. The long output shaft for the range box is hardened (like, “whoa” hardened…), and even carbide tooling struggled with it a bit. Don't ask me how I'm going to cut a keyway in them... I don't know yet. The NP203 shaft mics out at 1.520",so it'll need to be turned down a hair to fit in the 1.5" pillow block bearing that will support it near the end. The T-20 main shaft is unchanged from the stock dimensions, I'll just broach a keyway into the sprocket and it'll bolt right to the shaft. I didn't have any 50-2 chain laying around, sothis picture shows the single #50 laying on the sprockets to generally line things up (and a nice red bungee holding the other side....)



                              The input side of the NP203 already has an oil seal, so I’ll keep that unchanged. The output side of the NP203 will require a seal, since that side was originally opened, and shared oil with, the rest of the chain-driven transfer case. Additionally, the output bearing retainer was originally held in place by the rest of the transfer case. I cut out a couple 3/16” plates (one for each side) that will give me a place to weld mounts to, attached the output shaft pillow block, and mount an oil seal and bearing retainer to on the output side. Confused? Me, too….



                              Hopefully, the output shaft bearing retainer and the rest of the mounts will be next week’s project. It’s a slow process for me getting these things together, but once this darn range box isset, I can finalize the T-20 mounts and the engine mounts.
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