Custom build questions

[Middlefork Miner]

I'm looking for a little direction here...I just bought a cheap broken down Argo 6 wheeler mainly to rob the skid steer to build a (tracked)? AATV...I'm looking to come up with a better alternative than my last attempt...(cushman trackster) that seemed to rob power with the hydraulic drives in steep inclines. I need to be able to traverse snow, both powder & hard pack & need enough power to be able to power the machine up steep inclines without hesitation...I'm also wondering if an all aluminum frame might be a better option & maybe links to somebody who's done the same with a fabrication of the tub with either fiberglass or aluminum...dang this post is taking a long time... between trying to get dinner cooked & throwing my JRT's toys, this is hard... Any ways I'm kinda wondering what direction to go....build a frame for 6 wheels or eight? Powertrain options? How well are the EFI engines doing? Tracks??? I've looked at the videos on the Adair tracks & they look pretty nice but never having used either them or any others for the Argo I'm at a loss & looking forward for ya'lls input...
Oh yeah: This project may even inspire me to get back into killing ducks...& MUD...

[Mike]

Welcome to the site. What is your ultimate goal with your planned ATV? Are you just wanting to build something custom? If you are, that is cool but if not, I think you would be better off (read cheaper) to find something used and just rebuild it. If you are set on building everything from scratch, I would lean more towards the aluminum body than a fiberglass. There are a couple of custom builds here on the forums that you can take a look at to get some ideas. If you are not dead set on building your own body but still want to do a custom frame/drivetrain/etc. , then you could always buy a new upper and lower tub uncut from Argo and have that part out of the way. Then you can build your frame and place your axles wherever you want to.

If you are going to do a custom build I think I would consider using a T20 transmission in lieu of the older Argo one and then use a motor that is 27+ HP. For really deep snow you will need tracks. Any brand would do better than none.

You've got a pretty open ended question.

[brushcutter]

Hey Tom, I would think the t-20 would be the best choice as Mike says, although it would not have the advantage of hi/lo range, don't know if the one you have does, but an engine in the 27+hp category would make up for it. If possible, you may even think about a diesel in the same size range.
Now when you talk about powering up steep inclines, you might want to think about adding some auxiliary brakes if you go with a t-20, because usually if you go up a steep hill going into an area, you have to come down it on the way out, and although the bands will certainly stop your machine, if you are in extreme situations a little extra help might be nice, as would a roll bar!

This would be a good place to start looking http://www.6x6world.com/forums/other...r-ii-bwii.html (and guy to talk to)
Its state of the art homemade - state of the art!

Or... the easy route is to buy a decent project starter and build to suit your needs.

[Middlefork Miner]

Thanks...I've been looking through the videos & pics. Yes my tranny has the hi/low/reverse. What is the difference between the T-20 & Argo trannys? Is the Argo weaker? More prone to failure? Or more of a Chevy vs. Ford thing??? I'm not really looking to go fast with a hot rod type thing but Horsepower is never not good unless it starts to interfere with reliability...I certainly don't need an excess of power but need enough to be able to turn the tracks in any given situation...I'm also in no hurry to get this built, as long as I can get it done by next fall/winter. One thing that kind of surprised me was the weight of the frame/tub with the tires/wheels on...My train of though here is to keep it as light as possible thus helping to keep HP needs reasonable & maybe helping reduce the footprint in snow & aid in floatation...
Back to the tranny...should I look at selling it & looking for a T-20...pros & cons???

[nairb35]

The argo trans is like a tractor when a wheel spins it gets all the power so you have to brake it to put power on opposite side.The t-20 has power on both wheels all the time so when a side spins on a t-20 trans you pull power from the other side till the spinning side pulls again.Not a ford/chevy thing at all, however ford rules!

[Middlefork Miner]

MY Mind is spinning...

I hope you don't mind me using up a little bandwidth Mike... but after a couple few days of reading, the EASY, SIMPLE (cheap) project I envisioned has suddenly taken on its own life...My thoughts have gone from the original idea of using a tracked vehicle for crossing fresh game tracks in snow & ferrying mining equipment to & from my mining claim over the snow into a morphed version of endless possibilities....
From traversing parts of Alaska's interior & fording her rivers & bringing home some really good tasting moose meat...(Sarah Palins favorite) to leisurely float trips down the Feather & American Rivers during the summer/spring for stripers, smallmouth bass, crappie & catfish & camping on sandbars...the list is virtually endless as are the possibilities for putting together ones "Dream" machine......the last few years, I've been modifying Rokons trying to put together the "ultimate" off road bike... there is no such thing...as I suspect there will NEVER be a like version in 6 or 8 wheels...that said, right now, I'm leaning towards 8 wheels with tracks...the Argo tranny (which I already have) & going with keyed & pinned axles for simplicity & ease of field repairs.....Tracks wil be a definite addition down the road....Mods as needed...
I guess the key to the whole shebang is to do as bushwhacker suggested in his post about building the bushwacker I....don't second guess or over think...

Comments, advice greatly appreciated...


OH...before I forget...EFI or carb???...my gut & exp. tend to steer me towards EFI because operating altitudes will be anywhere from 10K to sea level....

Oh yeah...Mike...In one of my first posts, you asked if I just wanted something "custom"...the thing I've found to be true in EVERY application you can think of is that dang near as soon as a product is introduced, somebody will come up with a "modification" that will make it better...usually not only better but cheaper as well.
I can't help but look at the sticker price of a new Argo or Max & wonder where in the heck do they come up with the pricing??? Seems a little steep to me...especially for the "extras" & "upgrades"...

[lewis]

Just mt two cents:

8 wheeler is a good choice for the items you have mentioned you wish to carry. I wish you luck on your endeavor. Are there no used Argo's anywhere near you or do you just want to custom build something to more fit your specific needs. A EFI Argo would be a great choice for your needs or do your plans incorporate using a current body from a Argo and building custom around it...axles, engine, accessories?

[Middlefork Miner]

lewis...What I bought was a "in the overgrown weeds" argo, with 6 flat weather rotted tires & the back of the tub hacked off because the last owner wanted to try making it into an orchard sprayer...when I started dis assembly, I found the skeletal remains of a skunk down in the engine compartment...
For whatever reason though there was a brand new torque converter on the old engine...the engine itself had me scratching my head, wondering who the heck would DO what they did...the head, at the exhaust port had been threaded ( a couple of times) & a pipe was wedged in there so they could clamp on flex tubing for the exhaust...I kid you not...the fuel line was a combination of fittings, steel tube & hose... third world engineering at its finest...the battery that had last been hooked up, was sitting in the passenger compartment & was attached to a solenoid switch via 2 cables bolted together...

[Beeman]

I'd go EFI..

[lewis]

It seems as you have your work cut out for you.

[Middlefork Miner]

It seems as you have your work cut out for you.

The good news is that I don't consider it work... this kind of stuff is fun...my only problem is cash flow...paying the mortgage & making the truck payment takes a huge chunk out of the available fun money.

[Beeman]

Make sure you have a dedicated space for it.. that seemed to be my problem

[Middlefork Miner]

Well, dang...in the last couple weeks, looking here on 6X6 & reading about & looking at some of the different builds, the idea of a simple build got side tracked with a lot of new & different ideas. Watching the Mudd Ox videos got me to rethinking the hydro option that I had on my trackster...nice... Chris Davisons build of the Volkswagon powered build kinda tied a couple ideas together as has the Bushwacker II & as luck has it, there is a top notch hydraulic place a couple buildings down from where I work......Why is it that the simplest ideas morph like this...

[hydromike]

Why is it that the simplest ideas morph like this...

A lot of it has to do with all the great ideas on the Site, and all of the folks to lend knowledge and support. The common builds and restorations are safe territory, and they're a lot of fun to get a vintage machine up and running. On the other hand, a lot of folks like to put their own stamp on a project and either customize a stock machine, or build something from essentially scratch. It's the nature of all things mechanical. Build, test, destroy, improve....

Most of my ideas start simple, but I end up getting neck deep quite quickly with a cup of coffee in hand on a Saturday morning.

~m

[Noel Woods]

Sounds like you have some good concepts for your machine. Here is my two cents worth: Go with a diesel, I have a 25hp from A-1 Biofuel, photos are in the engine gallery, and there is footage on You-tube under: "Super Swamp Fox Diesel." Its a torque monster, direct injected, and very efficient (as in 8 hours run time per gallon.) I'd go with a T-20 for simplicity sakes, they are available, simple and rugged. Put a red spring clutch on the thing and it will surprise you with its capabilities. The Argo transmission you have is actually an open differential and you will loose power on the side that slips. I have always had 6 wheelers, but your terrain in Alaska may be so different that the 8 wheeled configuration may be best. Lastly, tracks are a sure thing. I recently saw a real life comparison of Adair Tracks vs. wheeled vehicles. Tracks win hands down.