New Type of Tracks - Chanel Tracks

[thorn]

more belting is going to help you more. A larger tire will give you more clean-out area between the belts, but an escargo, hybrid, or chanel-type track already has quite of bit of clean-out area in addition to the belt floatation. Adding belt width helps, especially if you don't want to add a winter kit. If you match tire and belting speeds (track-tuners is one way), you will have significantly....significantly...... more power to turn the track than you would with a track whose belting or other connecting material is at ground level alongside the tire tread. Even if you don't have low "track" gears, your performance should be plenty fine.

Okay so here is my dilemma I guess, I was considering in the next year or so doing a engine swap to a 27 hp which would run me around $2000-2500. My 2004 Conquest only has 90 hrs on it and I would be taking a big hit on a near new engine. I have the 3.3 tranny and my machine does quite well running the Supertracks with the 6" metal grousers on the out side edges, but I feel at times I could do a lot better with a bit more power, flotation, and traction.

So now you guys have me thinking that engine swap money might be better spent on a set of Chanel tracks with tuners. The tracks and tuners from what I am gathering, would give me increase in power, traction, and floatation. Between the gear reduction design and tuners It should be a very capable machine. I like that these tracks are more of an all around track and would be better suited when running in low snow/slush/mud conditions in the Fall and Spring. I want my Argo to be a dedicated tracked machine as I have a Polaris Ranger 6x6 for the warmer months.

As far as tires go, I guess I would just stick with my Runamuks and then go to something like what Old Tucker is running in a 22x10x8 when they wear out.

[Old Tucker]

I noticed on one of those photos, that the belting appeared to extend into the tire sidewall a fair bit. It's not a bad idea to trim it back (basically to where your washer or backer-plate begins.....just outboard of where the crosser/guide round-over would be. And bevel it at an angle (away). I use a stiff filet knife. Once you get a start and have a good pinch of belting to hold onto, (and keep your knife sharp), you can easily move pretty fast cutting with one hand while using the other to pull hard back and away on the cutoff piece (if that makes sense). Much easier than trying to bevel the belting with a utility blade.

In the raised belt tracks the belting may touch the tire at times. But the thing is the belt is traveling at the same speed as the tire so there is very little friction be tween the too. I also took a belt sander to the inside edge of the belt and took off the sharp edge. It worked great and it gave the inside edge a soft feel.

[Old Tucker]

Good to hear. I am watching your reports very closely as you have the same machine I do and you are running in the same type of conditions I do. I have a couple of questions though.

What tranny ratio are you running and how would you say the chanel tracks perform as far as engine power loss. Do you feel the machine had to work harder or less. I know you made a post about your tires you are running, but can you tell what they are again.

Do you guys think running a wider tire with these tracks is better or is narrower with more belting better for deep snow?

I hope you get your storm and can really get in the steep and deep.

My tranny is a M. And with the super track I was working the motor a little more then I liked. I also adjusted the clutch to gear it down and give me more torque and less top end speed.
But now with the chanel track I found with the belt gearing and the smaller tire. I do not even need the low range in the tranny. Lots of get up and go now. But to bring my speed back up I went the other way with the clutch. Now its just the way I want it. I still have lots of toque. and the motor is not working hard at all.
Now when I say a smaller tire. I am running a 22x11x8 Kenda K300 Dominator tire. And its mounted on a 8 inch rim In doing so the tire ended up been only 21 inch in diameter. Thats what I mean about a smaller tire. I wanted to run a wider tire so the tracks will have a flatter surface to run on. Less chance of track twisting..when on uneven ground.

Today I went out to play. And found that a big old ford truck made one big mess of the route I take up the mountain great big ruts in the snow The ruts were about 5 feet apart so you could not stratal themOne track would fall into the rut.:hmmmm2 And the road was not wide enough to go off to the side. Here is where I found the raised belt style track to be ideal. I was able to climb right out of the rut. Now I know for a fact that the super track would of come off. Or I would of just head to stay in the rut. There would be just to much pressure on the outer edge of a flatter track to run straight. I went at the Xditches at a angle just to see how the tracks would twist. And there was no twisting of the track at all. The Ascargo and the chanel track are a very good track design With the raised belt.

The photo showed I was doing some serious snow pushing to day in the xditches[IMG][/IMG]

[thorn]

My tranny is a M. And with the super track I was working the motor a little more then I liked. I also adjusted the clutch to gear it down and give me more torque and less top end speed.
But now with the chanel track I found with the belt gearing and the smaller tire. I do not even need the low range in the tranny. Lots of get up and go now. But to bring my speed back up I went the other way with the clutch. Now its just the way I want it. I still have lots of toque. and the motor is not working hard at all.
Now when I say a smaller tire. I am running a 22x11x8 Kenda K300 Dominator tire. And its mounted on a 8 inch rim In doing so the tire ended up been only 21 inch in diameter. Thats what I mean about a smaller tire. I wanted to run a wider tire so the tracks will have a flatter surface to run on. Less chance of track twisting..when on uneven ground.

Today I went out to play. And found that a big old ford truck made one big mess of the route I take up the mountain great big ruts in the snow The ruts were about 5 feet apart so you could not stratal themOne track would fall into the rut.:hmmmm2 And the road was not wide enough to go off to the side. Here is where I found the raised belt style track to be ideal. I was able to climb right out of the rut. Now I know for a fact that the super track would of come off. Or I would of just head to stay in the rut. There would be just to much pressure on the outer edge of a flatter track to run straight. I went at the Xditches at a angle just to see how the tracks would twist. And there was no twisting of the track at all. The Ascargo and the chanel track are a very good track design With the raised belt.

The photo showed I was doing some serious snow pushing to day in the xditches[IMG][/IMG]

Thanks fo the report. How do you feel floatation is compared to the Supertrack? I know you stated that the Chanels are in a whole different level than the Supertacks, I guess that is my last concern is floatation of the open track. I have seen some videos of the Chanel track digging down in the snow on an incline and I am just curious how they do climbing fairly steep terrain in deep snow.

[Buzz]

you will get more grunt with the elevated belt track, no doubt. Now you will also notice less throttle requirement and increased speed available with tracks installed (compared to tracks installed w/o track tuners). Ultimately you're overall top speed will go down simply because of the gear reduction. But remember these machines typically have 18-31 hp or thereabouts, so higher speed is a relative term, but your little engine will have plenty of grunt, especially in low range to operate effectively which is FAR more important than being able to go a little faster. If your conditions are so good you can go fast, well you can probably remove your tracks and operate on tires. Your overall drive ratio will go up (back to normal) simply by removing the track. Anyhow, You'll especially notice the improvement in turning and climbing because of the gear reduction and the crosser shape. Most of the conquests up here ar MU gearing (seemed like they were ordered that way), and have plenty of power for this style track. The elevated belt is absolutely the most stable in those crappy conditions (lots of other maneuving and sidehill conditions actually) that Old Tucker talks about. The guides cannot move on the belting (sidewall level) unlike most other track designs. As for the belting, it's easy to trim it back so it is outward of where the "up and over" radius of the crosser guide transitions to the belting. Especially with any decent amount of air in the tires, you'll very rarely touch the belting....so please bevel it out enough with a utility knofe. The belting thickness actually acts as additional guide height if needed. It constantly moves in relation to the tire, so friction would be present if you built a track with the belt sticking into the tire. Just trim it and it's a non issue altogether.

[brebett]

Hi, we had snow and lots of rain here saturday. I got a chance to try the chanel track on the lake. The snowmobiler didn't even want to go because of the slush. My body has a good skandic 20" track. He made it going straight but he got scared when turning. So I took my avenger and tried. I had to get to my ice shanty to raise it up. I had about 2 milles to go, all in deep slush. I made it with ease. No problem at all. There was lots of heavy wet snow. The argo was pushing all that. One time I decided to stop, back up and turning around. It made such a bid snow bank. It was as high as the hood and the chanel track were still pushing it. I turned in that stuff easy again. There is no way I would make it with those plastic track (I had some before on a response). I got stucked in less slush with them.
About tires mine are to stiff. I have 6 ply tires. I put 3 1/2 lbs of air and will possibly go down to 3#. When they wear out ( which I doubt) I will change to softer tires. I may even decide to sell them and put regular tires. I don't need agressive tires anymore. I will run on track all year.
Up to now I don't think those track would comme off. I had lots of problem with plastic track going off.
So the slush won't stop me anymore. It's hard to be worst than what it was and I made it easy. Next weekend I will go in deep snow in the bush.
Too bad I don't have a camera, it would make very impressive videos.

[Old Tucker]

Thanks fo the report. How do you feel floatation is compared to the Supertrack? I know you stated that the Chanels are in a whole different level than the Supertacks, I guess that is my last concern is floatation of the open track. I have seen some videos of the Chanel track digging down in the snow on an incline and I am just curious how they do climbing fairly steep terrain in deep snow.

In that snow, I was almost up to my waist when I tried to walk in it. The conquest sank about four to five inches and for climbing I was blown away on how good they were. BUT DO NOT SPIN THE TRACKS IF YOU CAN HELP IT. They dig down very fast. They would be just like the Escargo But the Escargo has a little taller crosser that would give you a little more bit. But so far the chanel track has been flawless, in the things I have put it through.
As for the floatation you will get a little more with a flat surface like the supper track. But if you can not go anywhere. Whats the point.

[Buzz]

agreed on the floatation aspect. You're machine will sink in a little bit more prior to engagement of the belting, but this also allows for "paddle engagement" of your track crossers. One benefit to a paddle-like design of an elevated-belt track is that you get that surface area for snow/mud etc. without having to drop to a super small tire to create enough tub clearance. Lots of other soft places (like tundra for example), turning is easier because the belting is elevated. It actually allows the ground-pressure effect of your 8-wheeler (on tires) to take effect. The tires provide adequate floatation in many conditions and prevent you from sinking too much futher than the belt. Or at least the belt does get squished too deep into the tundra. A narrower track or even a wider track with it's belting at the tread level plays hell trying to turn on that stuff. I would typically try not to run tracks because of it. Now, with an elevated belt design ( and an lot more experience with that set up ) I would prefer to run the tracks as it makes the ride over some of that stuff better as well and you're better prepared for transitional terrain and the power required to operate on it.

[brebett]

Hi guys, I finally got my argo with chanel track slushed good. I have to say that I made it putty far. There was 5 4 wheels with tracks and they all got stuck. They didn't come close to where I got and it took all afternoon to get them out of the lake. I did got stuck twice but it was easy to get out. I jacked the argo from the back and put 2 pieces of 2x6 under neat ( I always carry them just in case). I just back off and turn around. Nobody had to push or use a shovel like we did with the 4 wheelers. There was also 2 snowmobiles that slushed to. There was over 2 feet of slush and wet snow.
Tomorrow I have a day off so if the weather is ok there should be a good snow test. But at the moment there is a snow storm here ( blizzard) and they call for heavy wind and snow for tomorrow. If it is like today I won't go for sure.

[Old Tucker]

I am glad some one is getting winter. On the west coast of B.C. we are running around in shorts Its so warm I went back in the mountains yesterday And it felt like spring is here.
Glad to here the tracks are working great for you.. ENJOY. I am sitting back in the lawn chair thinking of fire ring up the lawn mower.

[guyfox]

Jack

If you do go what is the chance of some videos or even pics. Would like to have seen some in that slush.....

Have a safe and fun ride....

[brebett]

Not many chance of having pict or videos since I don't have any. My wife doesn't want to follow me when I go those places. But I'll try to get my brother in law to do some. As soon as I have some pict or vid I'll post them. Before I leave I'll have to get all the ice out from the slush because my argo is under a tarp outside and we've had wheater -40 for over a week here. We also have lots and lots of snow. Lots of fun coming...
I've always found places to get stuck no matter what machine I have. I've slept in the bush a few times with my snowmobiles stuck in the slush or sunk in a creek and have had a lot of walk with either my sleds, my max1V and my argos. Most of the time I'm alone since nobody wants to follow me To crazy I guess. I like to see what my machine are capable to do. But there is a price to that...

[thorn]

Hi guys, I finally got my argo with chanel track slushed good. I have to say that I made it putty far. There was 5 4 wheels with tracks and they all got stuck. They didn't come close to where I got and it took all afternoon to get them out of the lake. I did got stuck twice but it was easy to get out. I jacked the argo from the back and put 2 pieces of 2x6 under neat ( I always carry them just in case). I just back off and turn around. Nobody had to push or use a shovel like we did with the 4 wheelers. There was also 2 snowmobiles that slushed to. There was over 2 feet of slush and wet snow.
Tomorrow I have a day off so if the weather is ok there should be a good snow test. But at the moment there is a snow storm here ( blizzard) and they call for heavy wind and snow for tomorrow. If it is like today I won't go for sure.

Jack,
That is awesome. I hope I can get Marcel to ship to the USA, but maybe he does not want the trouble. We'll wait and see I guess.

[brebett]

Hi, no luck. There was a snow storm here saturday ( my only day off). Thre was no way to go out. we couldn't see more then 5 feet ahaid.
I'm off work friday and saturday so I guess I'll have at least a day for me.

[2014SE]

No doubt channel tracks are a good track design, this was my second choice after Escargo's. The combo Escargo and UHMW is a excellent idea to reduce weight and increase bouncy and keep sharper grousers in the tracks. The idea of UHMW with steel grouser inserts is also a good idea. The same old conclusion with all these threads on this site is their is no one best do all design, some guys love to argue that their track is the best but where you ride is different than the conditions where I ride and both of our conditions are going to be different than the other guy living 3000 miles away. I know I make decisions and after a little experience chance my mind, I'm of the opinion the raised belts are the way to go for stability and ease of turning. I spun around on steep side hills thinking theirs a good chance of driving out of the track on the high side when turning and it stayed in place!! Thankfully. I'm not experienced with UHMW tracks and was sceptical if they can take the cold and rocks. I know it's a good material but was wondering how they will stand up on a cold day spinning up a hill and digging down and catching some rocks, may break? May stand up well, like I said I don't know. Looking at the design of the Escargo and channel track it was easy to see theirs very little chance a machine the weight of a AATV can hurt the steel and cord reinforced belting, never say never but it looks strong and stable, and with curved edges to aid with steering.

I seen a picture of Tucker's showing the hinge connector that is the same as my Escargo's. I'd like to make a suggestion. Get gr8 bolts about 1/2" longer and after the track is connected roll it so your connection is down between the first and second tire. Tap the longer bolt in from the inside out and put on double lock nuts. This gives a little piece of mind that your not going to loose a hinge pin on the trail.

http://www.6x6world.com/gallery/6x6-around-the-world/p20983-track-hinge.html